Conference noted::equitation

Hi,


	Does you insurance cover not continue if you start treatment
	before holly turns 15 ???

	Also what is "MSM" ?????

	Sorry I cant be of any help with the lamness, but I have a look in 
	my books tonight if you like ,..../??


Rachel 

    Rachel,
    
    MSM is a "natural" substance which stands for Merthyl Sulphonyl Methane
    and supplies bio-available suphlur (???).  It is supposed to be a wonderful
    anti-inflammatary which is fed orally although I do believe you can buy
    a creme form for external use.  The blacksmith strongly recommended I
    use it for reducing the swelling in her fetlock and thus reducing the
    pressure on the internal structure - or something like that.
    
    Any advice would be appreciated.  Everyone's books give different
    opinions and they do say it's best to have an open mind.
    
    Thanks.
    
    Liz

Liz,


	Well I've had a look in my book and well I can see nothing 
	under the heading of "Annular Ligament Lameness".

	I have several pages with ref to Tendons/Ligament  problems 
	but that is it ..


	If you like I could copy them and either fax them to you or 
	give them to Kevin ????


Rachel

Liz,


	Sorry , Or I could lend you the book ??

Rachel 

    Liz,
    
        Hi..Not really a lot of help here but just a few things...
    
        My last horse Tess strained a Tendon while I was on holiday and a
        friend was looking after her...The vet also gave MSM and this
        helped greatly and within 6 weeks I, very slowly, was able to start
        building her back up to fitness...
        So I do recommend using MSM as a way of helping reduce the
        swelling.....
    
        The problem that I had with Tess is that I think I started jumping
        her again too soon..it was about 3 1/2 months (ish..can't really
        remember exactly)  and she actually strained her tendon again..it
    	was the front left one...This time it wiped her out for good and
    she really couldn't be riden properly again...I can't really remember
    what the Vet said at the time but it was clear that her Tendon would
    keep going as it was now quite weak etc...She was really only good for
    very light hacking etc...(not what a 15 yr old really wants!!) So in
    the end I gave her to a friend who was after a companion horse for his
    Race Horses etc....
     
    To be honest I have never actually heard of what your horse is
    suffering, is it the same sort of thing as a strained Tendon???
    
    I'm sure it will all be OK....I will check a few things out with
    a few horse `gurus' at my stables this weekend and keep you informed
    of any info that I can get about this...
    
    Just really wanted to let you know what happened to me with Tess...to
    tell you where I went wrong!!1 I hope I haven't worried you even more!!
    
    Keep me updated OK!
    
    Vikki

    I too have had experience with tendon strains - bowed tendons to be
    exact, but have not seen a damaged annular ligament.  My brother had an 
    off-the-track TB who had bowed a tendon racing.  It was
    a smaller (under 3") bow and he had been told by a vet who took x-rays
    after he got the horse that it was a 'set' bow and should not be a
    problem.  Still, 5 years later it began giving the horse trouble and
    x-rays and ultrasound at Tufts showed the tendon to be heavily damaged
    (it had the look of swiss cheese).  The Tufts vet recommended the
    horse be ridden only lightly, with raised heels on his shoes, and 
    avoiding jumping and hillwork.  The explanation the vet gave for the
    two sets of x-rays taken 5 years apart being so different was that
    over time, it continued to weaken and deteriorate as a result of the
    original injury as a three year old.  He went into an explanation of
    what happens to horses who are worked hard before they are physically
    ready for it, but I can't get into *that* without starting a rathole
    on racing. :-)  
    
    At any rate, take it easy with Tess and give her a *lot* of time to
    heal properly, and good luck! Let us know how she is doing!
    

    HI,
    
    Thanks for the advice and support.  Holly has been worse over the
    weekend.  She's not so bad when she's brought in from the field in the
    morning but is *much* worse when turned out at the end of the day after
    standing around in the stable and her fetlock becomes rock solid.  I
    spoke to the vet last night and he's coming out this evening to see her
    at feeding time when she's normally turned out and is much worse.  I
    would personaly like to get things moving a bit more quickly and take
    her off for x-rays at the end of the week if he agrees.  He had
    previously said wait a month to see if there is any improvement.
    
    I'll let you know what he says after the visit tonight.
    
    Thanks
    
    Liz

Liz,

	Did the Books Help ????

	I said to Kevin,that I did a quick look and could see 
	nothing .....


Rachel 

    Rachel,
    
    Thanks for the loan of the books (I can be so rude sometimes!).
    
    Unfortunately they didn't mention anything about the annular ligament. 
    I have a very heavy in depth book at home which touches lightly on the
    subject so if you ever have any problems it lists just about
    *everything*.
    
    Thank you again, I did scan through everything else in them and learnt
    a fair bit.
    
    See you
    
    Liz

    Liz,
    
    Did you manage to get hold of some MSM?? what has your vet said about
    using it??  
    
    I am still trying to find out what I can about Annular Ligament
    Lameness and will let you know if I hear anything about it that you
    don't seem to know already!!
    
    How was she last night???
    
    By the way, You didn't go to a BBQ on Thursday did you?? and spoke to
    someone called Vikki???!!!
    
    

    Hi,
    
    Yes I did go to the BBQ on Thursday and chatted to Vikki - say hello
    for me if you see her please - nice lass!
    
    Well, the vet came out last night and seemed quite pleased with Holly's
    progress (or lack of I thought).  He doesn't really have much thought
    about MSM but said to continue using it if I wanted to as it certainly
    wouldn't do any harm.
    
    Her fetlock has gone down slightly but I can't really see it myself
    being a paranoid mum.  Now that it's not so puffy the annular ligament
    is not putting as much pressure on the tendon sheaths which suggests
    that the annular ligament is not the problem (or it would be
    contricting still event with teh swelling reducing).  Tony (the vet)
    said it was not worth x-raying until another week or so as it often
    takes that long for lesions etc to show up on the x-ray.  He is now
    looking a arthritic change perhaps causing the problem.
    
    Our course of action now is to continue to rest her for a week with her
    still being allowed to move around as she stiffens up standing still. 
    He said to lunge on a right rein (it's her near hind that's affected)
    in a weeks time for a couple of minutes.  If she's still chronically
    lame and simply can't go on then obviously stop but the main idea is to
    see if she loosens up with exercise (arthritis?)  Either way I think
    we'll go for the x-rays before my insurance expires in February just to
    be on the safe side.  He didn't think Navicular (that dreaded word) had
    a part to play here but did mention the sesamoid bone in passing.  
    
    I think only time will tell now, roll on next week when we can finally
    get to the bottom of this, I have no patience as it sets your mind
    wandering.
    
    Thanks againf or your support.
    
    Regards
    
    Liz

    Liz,
    
    So if it turns out to be Arthritus  is there any thing the Vet can
    do or give her to treat it?? Sorry if this is a silly question...this
    again is something I haven't come across with one of my horses.
    Whatever it turns out to be will she recover?
    
    Are you still turning her in during the day? if she seems to be worse
    after being in a stable all day, would it not help her if she were
    turned out all day.
    
    All I can really say is Good Luck..and let me know what happens...
    
    Vikki <-- The one you were speaking to at the BBQ!!! (Strange really) 

    Vicki
    
    If it is arthritis then I could put her on bute (painkiller)
    indefinately as it is best to keep moving but obviously not if she is
    in pain, hence the bute.  If I did not use bute then she would be in
    varying degrees of pain and would probably not be workable for a very
    long.
    
    There are alternatives to bute, ie. holistic healing which I preferably
    try first of all.  We have a wonderful range of herbs produced by
    Hilton Herbs, from experience I have seen a bad tempered,
    uncoperatable, stiff mare (in season) win a dressage competition which
    it could never have done without the "tailor-made" herbs.
    
    Like my friend in the States said (hello Eileen!), in some ways it
    would be a relief to find out she had arthritis and not navicular
    (example).
    
    I really appreciate all of your advice.
    
    Thanks
    Liz

    Hi,
    
    Just a quick update to let you know we've had the x-rays which showed
    up great, no problem and that we have A1 tendons!!
    
    The ultrasound though did show up the constriction of the annular
    ligament.  Tony (my vet) has said to trot her up at the end of next
    week and if she is lame then he'll put it to the insurance company that
    she has surgery.  Not sure if I've mentioned much about this in earlier
    replies but it's supposed to be fairly straight forward and Holly will
    have to stay at the vets for a couple of days.  The recovery is
    unbelievable - she will be ridden two weeks after the operation,
    possibly earlier although it will be back to basics with the 10 mins
    walking slowly increasing over 4-6 weeks etc.
    
    I have also found another horse with the same condition - a large
    hunter type in a stable 5 minutes from where we are.  Unfortunately his
    case is very severe and doesn't leave much hope.
    
    So, now onto the subject of operations - any tips, worries, stress
    relieving miracles that can make the couple of days as easy as possible
    for me and the horse.  I plan to stay at the place where she has the
    operation so I'm nearby as it is a drive from home.
    
    Thanks
    
    Liz

    To keep you updated.....
    
    The insurance company has said yes today to the operation.  My vet Tony
    now has to contact the actual vet who will perform the surgery to
    organise a date etc.
    
    Any helpful hints on travelling horses to the vet, especially the
    staying away from home part of it (for the horse, not me!).  I will
    miss her like mad but will go out there every day to see her, if not
    stay where she's going.  I know she's like a lost child if I'm not
    there and constantly calls to me until she can see me again.  This is
    going to be diffucult for both of us.
    
    Liz

    Well, Holly had her operation yesterday and so far everything seems to
    be going well, she was pretty unwell and not with it when I went to
    visit yesterday but hopefully she'll be much better tonight.
    
    I should be able bring her home on Saturday, all going well.  I'm not
    sure what happens next so I'll have a chat with the vet tonight.

Liz,


	How is she ???, Kevin mentioned some bits but I was sure what he was    
        trying to tell me ...?
	
	How did she travel home aswell , was she ok.?


Rachel .. 
	

    Rachel,
    
    Ummm, where do I start?  This isn't quite as easy as we hoped it would
    be although she did travel home no problem.  I had to call the vet out
    last weekend as the cut was breaking down extremely badly and he
    removed the stitches, he was due to do so on Monday anyway.  Since last
    Sunday he has been out everyday and has also started her on antibiotics
    for fear of infection in the cut.
    
    It hasn't exactly turned sceptic but part of the inside of her leg sort
    of made its way outside of her leg, a mess of connective tissue, fatty
    deposits etc. and has been making it diffucult for the wound to heal
    properly.  Tony said he could stitch it back up again but felt that
    would do more damage than good as there is fluid still draining out of
    the area and also the stitches aren't really approriate for that area
    as they would dig in and perhaps aggrevate the area more.
    
    So, he came out again last night and it looked much better than before,
    he's not out again probably until Saturday morning so in the meantime I
    have to redress it once a day and wash the cut (& inside - literally)
    with salt water, put powder on it and redress with melonin pads, gamgee
    etc. and vetrap (wonderful stuff!).  She's being walked out twice a day
    which can now start increasing for longer periods of time.  So far
    she's just beem walking up to the gate, stopping for a graze and then
    back to the stable again, I have to do this in the morning too which is
    no problem at 6.30am at the moment whilst we're having beautiful
    weather but I'd hate to think of what it'll be like in a few weeks!
    
    In herself she seems absolutely fine, perky and cherpy and her normal
    self really.  She doesn't seem to be complaining about being in the
    stable either whereas normally she'd have got fed up by now.  Tony the
    vet is under the impression she's an angel as she stands rock solid
    still whilst he literally pulls the insides of her leg outside to look
    at and clean (without anaesthetic).  Wait till he sees her on a
    "normal" day.  She has no problem with the leg but when he went towards
    her with a syringe in his hand she made it clear on both occasions she
    was having none of that!!  Well, I'll keep you posted on how she is and
    how the wound is healing - that's the only thing that's the problem now
    so I'm praying it looks okay tonight which mean's it will be 2 days in
    a row that it's been decent which may mean progress!!  I hope so.
    
    See you soon
    
    Lizzie