Conference noted::equitation

    
    Pasture:  We have 3 horses in a 6 acre pasture.  It is TRUE that the
    horses will eat where the manua is not.  We have run out of room in
    our 6 acre pasture because the owner does not belive this fact.  He is
    a wonderful man and I love him dearly, but our horses are not getting
    what they need from the pasture becasue it has not be turned over and
    reseeded every year.  You can walk out in the pasture and see the tall
    green grass where the manur was/is and the horses will not go near it.
    
    I did get my owner to make us another small pasture area where we turn
    them out in once the grass starts to grow
    
    Manua:  We have a place were we put it, till it piles up - then we pay
    to have it all taken away twice a year.

    Who takes it away?  How much do you pay?  How did you find them?

    Ditto!  Excellent question!  I've always had a neighbor who
    took it, but he's recently discovered that it is *not* the
    best substitute for hard fill. :) :(
    

    
    My hubby has a 6 wheel dump truck - it holds 20ton of stuff.  He takes
    it way and dumps (I forget where, I'll ask) for $65.00 - we split that
    3 ways - so it's nice and affordable.  :-)
    
    Louisa

    I've always had good luck advertising free manure through the garden
    notesfile at Digital.  I created a .dis list and would update the 
    takers when more was available.  Sometimes you can hook up with a 
    farmer or someone who will also come haul it out for free.
    
    As far as pastures go, I find that to have enough grass to feed a 
    horse for the spring-fall, you have to have a pretty good sized
    pasture!  My horses are turned out in dirt paddocks, nothing huge
    but enough so they can kick up their heels and get a little exersize.
    I'd love to be able to have big pastures, and hopefully will be
    able to do so someday as we just built a house on 10 acres but it
    isn't a reality right now.  No complaints from the horses either...*8^)
    they're very well fed!

    For people who want the manure for their gardens...do they want fresh
    stuff, or do you aim them at the part of the pile that's been there a
    while?  
    
    "They" say you need an acre a horse, and that you should break that up
    into smaller fields so that you can rotate.  Does anybody really do
    that, and can you keep your horse in grass from spring to fall with two
    half-acre fields?

Sue,

we just put a sign up "Free horse manure", and we have
more takers then manure! We have people coming on a 
weekly basis picking it up!

Last year we had assembled a huge pile (2 horses for
1 1/2 years). One add in the Gardening Notes file got
us more takers than we could satisfy.

We have two fields (1 acre each) and a riding ring.
Till May we keep the horses (2) in the ring, otherwise they
would dig up everything, and then we rotate. One field is
the "rough" one, and the other one is used on Sundays --- so
to speak. Works fine.
1/2 acre fields should do for you --- if you fertilize!
We mow away most of our gras --- once it grows high the
bugs and the mosquitos get into it, and we cant convince our
horses to go try it.

Marc

PS I am in OGO (I guess you are too). Give me a call if
you want to talk horse. 276 9735

    We have 3 horses in a six acre field.  The field is split into two, one
    is complete pasture and the other has an outdoor school which is fenced
    off within the field although the horses have constant access to it so
    as not to reduce their grazing.  We rotate the two fields putting the
    horses in one through Spring, summer and early autumn and then move
    them into the other for winter.  They spend less time in the winter one
    as the ground can easily become wet around gate entrances and below
    trees.
    
    Every one week in three each of us has to do our turn at muck 
    cleaning.  This normally takes about 1 hour (a little longer in the
    winter).  The grass is excellent quality, too good in fact but it's
    pleasing to the eye to look on a "clean" field!
    
    The landowner whom we pay rent to has a local farmer take the muck away
    when we ask him to.  This is usually once every 6 months although now
    all horses are bedded on shaving the muck heap shouldn't become as
    large this time round (everyone was on straw at first).
    
    That's our system and it works wonders!
    people and three horses)

Until recently I kept my horses at home (well a relatives house).

You can very easily run into difficulties with local authorities (especially
here in the UK), if you have a large manure pile, especially if you try to burn
off any of it (my TB was kept in (on straw) virtually the whole of the winter as
he was such a wimp!).

You are not 'allowed' to keep a manure pile of a certain size, or burn any of it
off unless you're in a particular trade such as a farmer.  You must ensure that
the pile is collected by someone with the relevant licences to collect,
transport and dispose of it (this obviously doesn't include gardeners with small
amounts!), and apparently you can be fined if you pay someone to collect and
they don't dispose of it properly...

With regard to pasture rotation, we had 6.5 acres for 3 horses, split into 4
fields and rotated, this seemed to work well, the fields were cleaned every
week.  

Unfortunately my horse had to be put down, now I have an aged pony with 2 others
on 10 acres of rich pasture (see note on laminitis!!), which I'm in the process
of dividing into 3 fields, with a play pen for the fatties.  This is cleaned
every 2 days, the muck here is mainly collected by gardeners!

Regards,
Sarah

    Sue,
    
    I use the dirty shavings (minus manure) for my riding ring. I spread 
    them out and it helps to keep down the dust in the summer.
    
    I put the manure in a pile and offer it for free to gardeners. You
    need to be careful where the pile is because some zoning laws state
    that it has to be so many feet inside your property line, and it
    cannot be near any water wells.
    
    I usually pick the manure out of the field, but in the fall I
    mow it with the lawn tractor. It grinds it up and makes good 
    fertilizer for the grass (the downside is that parasites are spread 
    also).
    
    Gardeners should use "old" manure. "Fresh" horse manure is very
    acidy and will kill some vegetables. Also "fresh" horse manure has
    alot of undigested seeds (oats etc...) in it and makes for alot
    of weeds in a garden which is a pain. Which is why some people prefer
    cow manure. Cows chew their food more efficiently and chew their 
    cud (regurgitate and re-chew food) so the end result is less seeds.
    Horses tend to pass alot of the seeds. If you ever check the manure
    you will see these seeds if your horse eats any sweet feeds. 
    
    But, I LOVE having my critters at home! :-)
    
    Tina
    

    re. 10
    
    I grind up the "road apples" with my mower, too.  I believe it is an
    effective way to expose more manure to the sun and rain, which also
    destroys the parasites' environment; this effectively destroys
    parasites.  In addition, I drag an old iron bedspring over the pasture
    to further break-up the manure.  It does spread it out, but again, the
    sun does a much more effective job once it's broken up.
    
    We keep 4 horses on a 4 acre pasture, broken up into a riding ring, 2
    small paddocks, 2 fields of 1.5 to 2 acres.  We rotate them on the
    pasture, which really helps restore the grass.  In addition, our 1 acre
    yard is fenced for extra grass when it's needed.  JW

    I've always had my two horses at home...we seem to have a pretty good
    system, husband feeds in the a.m. I do evening and the cleaning.  We
    just purchased a tractor to help move the manure!!!  
    
    Now we're moving and although I can have the horses at our new place
    I'm thinking of boarding for the summer months (I have a frient with
    pastures) and moving them home for the winter.  
    
    But, I do love to look out the window and see them running around their
    corrall in the morning and just being able to go out and brush, talk or
    give a treat too.  I think I'm going to miss that.
    
    

    I think one of the nicest things about keeping the horses at home is
    the relationship you get with them.  A lot of the trust and respect
    you develop during the 2-3 daily feedings and care help you also in the 
    saddle.
    
    Another benefit is that I can make small turnouts off each stall.  When
    they can go in and out as they please all day and night they never get
    stiff joints, the vets say it's really good for them.  I think they're 
    happier too.  It's nice there's less stall cleaning this way (picking
    up outside is easier than picking through shavings), but unfortunately
    there's more horse cleaning (they lay outside a lot, even when it's
    muddy).  Also when they walk in and out all day, they bring in dirt and
    I have to throw out all the chips sometimes when they get too dusty, even 
    though they're clean. I go through less shavings than if they were locked in
    though.
    
    I have two piles, one for shavings, one for manure.  After the manure
    is a year old I mix it with dirt for my flower gardens.  I plan 
    a new garden each year, I've even started shady flowers on my
    driveway (plants that will come back each year, so not much work). I
    use the shavings too, the urine has been rinsed out by the rains and I 
    use them as mulch after things come up some.  I pile on six inches of it 
    on all the flower beds, they seal in the moisture so I never have to water, 
    and they keep down the weeds. (at least until the chickens and the dog
    and the pig get at them)  :-)
    
    Sharon

    I keep my two at home, and would not ever even consider boarding again.
    It is a *huge* commitment, though, and a lot of work.  
    
    Like the previous noter, my two have 'free access' turnout - the barn
    opens directly onto the turnout area and they can come and go as they
    please.  At winter they are stalled at night, and in severe weather
    I will bring them in.  Rarely do they go in on their own accord,
    although when the bugs are bad they will stand in the aisle (my
    stalls open onto the main aisle, which in turn opens onto the 
    turnout).  This does reduce stall cleaning a bit - and increases
    paddock cleaning.  I have a medium sized ring, which adjoins a
    mid-sized paddock.  I remove the droppings twice a week using a
    pitchfork and wheelbarrow.  Takes about 15 - 20 minutes, and is
    well worth the effort.  My manure pile is back behind the barn.
    I used to have a guy who took it away regularly, but am now
    trying to find someone else who wants it.  That gardening conference
    is starting to look good - I dont' have time to garden myself.
    
    We have a 5 acre area behind the ring/paddock the is partially
    cleared, and will make excellent pasture - once I can afford to
    have the rest of the standing lumber cleared and the whole area
    de-stumped.  The cost of de-stumping is prohibitive right now,
    but we're hoping to be able to do it in the next few years.  With
    this set up, I could allow them free access directly to the pasture,
    or just the paddock, or both.  Someday!
    

    I keep my two horses at home. We have 5 acres but only use the back 
    3 regularly for turnout. This area is primarily dirt and very 
    little grass ever gets a chance.
    
    I have our front two acres seeded with pasture grass and I do 
    turn them out there on Sundays ;-) when someone is home (I have
    only electric fence in the front field and have had a couple of
    "Harry Houdini" episodes - my three year old will walk right 
    through electric fence - charged or not.
    
    I find I have to keep the front mowed to keep the weeds down
    I think that is recommended regardless of how big your pasture is.
    
    RE: Manure pile - I have about 1/2 acre garden area that I use it 
    in. We have really good luck with it. Also - my next door neighbor
    is an avid vegetable farmer and takes away alot of my aged stuff.
    
    I have found that basically my horses *do* have two areas that
    they confine their manure activities to. I clean out the paddock
    once a month.
    
    Overall - I love having my buddies at home for all of the reasons
    mentioned previously. The one down side for me is that I live in
    a somewhat remote area and I miss the socializing with humans that
    you get when your boarding out. Also - most of your service
    providers (vets, farriers, feed store) want you "on-site" when 
    delivering services. Also - finding a trainer that will travel to 
    your 2 horse barn can be a challenge too.
    
    And you had better have a trusted horse person available to house-
    sit if you want to go on a vacation!

    		Now that you have most of the 'good' stuff.  It is a 
    	HUGE commitment having your horses in the back yard.  You had
    	better be very, very sure that this is what you really want.
    	It is a daily activity......feeding, mucking, watering.  Nothing
    	like frozen water buckets in the winter!  Not to mention all the
    	great muddy, mucky mess in the spring and fall!  Finding a reliable
    	hay dealer, and/or feed distributer.  It is a lot of work.  No more
    	just packing up and going away on vacation either.  Have to find
        AND pay for a horse sitter.  Fence repair, etc.  It all adds up and
    	it is not for everybody.  Take your time and make sure it is really
    	what you want to do.  I should also say, make sure it is something
    	that your significant other wants to do too.....
    
    			FWIW,
    
    			   Bob   
    

    I had my horses at home for 12 years and then was horseless for 6
    years.  I have been boarding them out now for 7 years and I would find
    it very difficult to keep them at home again.  I have 2 kids in sports
    and with shows and traveling it is very, very convenient to pay someone
    for their feed and turnout.  I am there in most of my free time
    anyways, but this way I don't "have" to be home.
    
    Karen