Conference noted::equitation

    The cost of building a barn depends on too many factors to give you a
    number. Not only the number of stalls comes into it. How big will the
    stalls be? Will there be hay storage in the barn? What type of
    construction(Pole barn or poured foundation w/ 2x4 type framing)? Will
    the siding and roof be sheet metal? Wash stall? Utilities? How big a
    tack room? How much of the construction work will be done by the owner?
    What about the site? Does it need grading to make it useable? , etc etc
    etc.
    
    Depending on the answers to those kinds of questions, one could spend
    between $15 and $40 per square foot of floor space in the barn.
    For something that will be a commercial boarding stable, you'd probably
    want to be in the middle or the upper end of the range(e.g. $30-$35/sqft).
    
    Indoor arenas are pricey. Someone near me recently built a 12 stall
    boarding facility with a 100'x200' indoor arena attached. The total
    price tag was over $300,000. Around here(WA), the typical cost of
    putting up a 60'x100' *covered* arena(i.e. roof but no sides) is
    something like $40,000. 
    
    You can read more about barns by picking topics from the index in Note
    4. Currently, topics with the BARNS keyword are in 4.18 You might also
    check out 4.133 NEW_OWNER and 4.172 STABLE_MGMT for further reading
    
    Note 1852 has a recent discussion of horsekeeping costs.

    We are in process of designing our barn.  It will be a 32 X 60 post and 
    beam (pine - with beautiful decorative/curved braces).  Some of the
    particulars are concrete isle and floors in all areas other than stall
    areas, also a 12X6' concrete apron at each end to facilitate easy
    entry, and exterior pads for the wash area and propane tanks (gotta
    have heat and hot water!).  The loft will not be totally enclosed
    so we'll have a 12X20' access at the front with removable railings
    (to accomadate hay and shavings delivery).  The Cupola will be all
    copper clad with a thermostatically controlled exhaust fan.
    All stalls have a 1�X1�" crib iron on any exposed corners.
    
    Our builder has done several of these barns and they are beautiful -
    and the appeal of an old style post and beam barn.  (This guy also did
    our house).  We expect the price to be somewhere in the $25 - $?? per
    square fooot range, depending on how many extras we order.  
    
    If you friend is in the Worcester MA area, he should Check out Phil
    Sheridan and Hardwick Woodworking (P & B timber framer).  He very
    detail oriented and awsome to Work with!!!!!

�                      <<< Note 1881.0 by KAHALA::MURPHY >>>
�                           -< BARN BUILDING COSTS? >-

Something else to look at :)

This month's issue of Equus (#199, May 1994) had a good article on "Better 
Horsekeeping", 20 common planning and construction errors.  I thought it 
had pretty good suggestions and ideas (and plenty of things for me to 
think about when I get to build my barn some day :)

    re: 1881.2
    
     How many stalls are you planning on ?

    I think we have 6 10X12 stalls planned.  A 12X20 heated tack room, 
    a 10X12 feed room, and a 10X12 utility area w/ 4'stairway to the loft.
    
    We are also pricing an oak timberframe, because we'd need less of a
    roof structure that we would with pine - since oak is stronger.  The
    timber framer thinks it could be close to a wash.  The oak is a much
    prettier frame in my eyes because of the warm honey color and natural
    checking which occurs over time.  The pine checks less and tends to 
    gray more that get warm and honey like....but we'll see when the final
    figures come in.
    
    
    WHat are you planning on?  What have your numbers come in at?
    

    I don't have numbers at all yet.  The guy in Pelham is calling a
    builder to help with ideas.  I'm going to give him the name of the
    person you recommended.  6 stalls is about what he is thinking now.
    I'd really appreciate it if you would keep me posted on how you are
    making out.  I'll pass on any learnings/suggestions you have based
    on this experience.  Thanks very much for the info and good luck !

    re: 1881.5
    
     Just thought of something.  Does the $25 - $?? per square foot
    figure include the hardware, etc for stalls ?
    
     Thanks again  !

    Yes.  My builder found a guy in Attleboro who makes all the hardware,
    and of course does custom work.  The price includes everything we can
    think of including all the extras.......but we haven't decided on 
    what we need now and what can wait till next year.  

    There are several things tha tcome to mind that *usually* are NOT
    included in a builder's price per sq. foot:
    		Getting utilities(water, electric) to the site.
    		Electrical work to install lights and outlets, etc.
    		Permit and inspection fees
    		Engineering work(civil or structural) required by local
    			authorities to get permits
    
    Examples:
    
    If it's a bare site(e.g. open land w/ no house, etc), you'll have to
    get the local electrical utility to run poles, wire and transformer.
    
    Even if there is a house on the land, the electricity for a commercial
    barn should be on a separate meter for accounting/tax purposes. Also,
    the electrical service to the house may not have capacity  to extend
    power to a barn. In either of those 2 cases, the local electrical
    utility will have to install transformers/meters etc and that will cost
    you money.
    
    If there's a water utility or well drilling costs, those are not
    included either.
    
    The last time we built a barn, no contractor included electrical work
    in the estimate. In WA state, you need special licenses to even
    sub-contract electrical work to licensed electricians. Laws on this
    vary *significantly* from one state to another so check. For example,
    in CA a general contracor can do anything. In WA, a general contracor
    can't do electrical or plumbing work.
    
    If you have to get building permits, plumbing permits, electrical
    permits, etc, those are usually your costs.
    
    If you need any engineering work to get permits, those too are your
    responsibility over and above the contractor's estimate. We had to have
    civil engineering work and a wetlands ecological survey because our 
    property has a creek on it. We also were required to have an engineer
    review the structural plans because pole barns aren't covered by the
    universal building code that the county uses as its guide. They didn't
    care who designed it(Frank Llloyd Wright, US Government or whoever). If
    the plans didn't have a stamp on them from a WA licensed engineer, no
    permit! Anyway, those kind of costs are not included and can be
    significant.
    
    John