Conference noted::equitation

    As the owner of the TB being discussed, I am going to start a minor 
    rat-hole about why we ride with bute (when necessary).  This TB has 
    navicular in the early stages, but it is enough to cause him pain
    without the corrective shoeing.  Even with the wedge pads and rolled
    toe, he can have his bad days.  When this happens, we give him bute
    well before we ride so it has time to take the pain away.  I expressed
    concern about riding him this way since I do not want to worsen the 
    condition by masking the pain.  I was told by 3 different vets (my
    regular vet, the Rochester clinic vet, and a well respected vet who is
    a friend of the family) that using bute while riding would not cause
    the disease to worsen.  One analogy was to think of it as being similar
    to arthritis in humans.  The bute allows the horse to live a full and
    active life, but riding him with it does not cause the nav. to worsen. 
    The shoeing and the type of riding I do have much more to do with the
    nav. than riding with bute.  
    
    As far as racing goes, I do have issues with it, since the 2 vets that
    examined my horse both think his early racing training (I got him as a
    2.5 year old - from the tracks) caused the nav., primarily because of
    the angle racer's feet.  If a horse is in pain and is given a pain
    reliever to race, fine, as long as racing without pain doesn't worsen
    the condition.  If, like my guy, it doesn't worsen it, but allows the
    horse to run free of pain, I think it is fine to use the drugs.  The
    trouble you run into is unscrupulous trainers who will run a horse on
    medication KNOWING it will make their drug-free life worse.

               If I have a headache, I take aspirin and continue
    with my day.  Giving a horse bute, is basically the same thing.
    No?  If my vet told me that I should give my TB some bute, to
    take the edge off any slight pain, and that his condition, what
    ever it was, would not worsen by riding.  Then, I would certainly
    do it.  We have given our horse bute when he has, say, cut himself.
    Now, you're gonna tell me not to ride because we've given him bute?
    Maybe I shouldn't go to work after I've taken aspirin......... ;^)
    
                      Bob   

    My TB/WB suffers very badly from cold damp weather, especially
    freeezing fog and similar conditions. He gets very stiff in this
    sort of weather, and if he didn't have bute he'd not only have
    severe discomfort every time he moved, but the lack of inclination
    to move would cause him to get even more stiff, and he'd end up
    with God knows what problems with his joints. I also know a 20 year
    old ID mare who is arthritic; with bute she hacks, hunts and drives
    (all activities she loves), without it she'd be for the meat man...
    
    JJ.

    I agree that use of bute for the riding horse who has off days does not
    seem unethical or abusive at all.  But I'd also think that the owners
    of these horses, if instructed by their vets to give the horse two
    weeks rest, would have no problem complying.  All too often, however,
    this is not what happens at the track.  If a horse starts coming up
    lame, this can be a sign that injury to tissues is occurring, which
    will become nastier as time goes on.  Rest is usually called for, and
    this gives the injury time to heal before being stressed again.  (By
    injury, here, I don't mean something major, just the stress on
    still-growing muscles, tendons, bones, etc.)  But bute "allows" this
    rest not to happen.  It's been mentioned here that bute does not allow
    an unsound horse to run, and with major unsoundness I guess this is
    true.  It won't do a thing for a bowed tendon.  But what it does allow
    is for an already stressed joint to be stressed even more whan it
    *should* be rested.  What would you think if your horse was sore, and
    the vet told you to "give him some bute and go gallop him around as
    fast as he can go"?  You'd go to another vet, fast.  Because your aim,
    and your vet's, is to keep your horse sound as long as possible.  The
    aim of a trainer at the track is to keep the horse running as often as
    possible.  Before the days of bute, horses used to get rested.  This
    almost never happens now unless the horse is three-legged lame.
    
    Using bute probably doesn't worsen any injury in an adult horse.  But
    in a young horse, anything that allows stress to continue on already
    stressed tissue is certainly allowing a condition to worsen.  
    
    -ellie
      

    In support of what was said by ESCROW::ROBERTS in the reply titled
    -< Take some aspirin and stay off it for a while... >- I offer the
    following quote from an article on musculoskelatal injuries(breakdowns)
    and cardiopulmonary disorders(bleeding & respiratory problems) in The 
    Grayson-Jockey Club Research Foundation's Newsletter:
    
    "Reports from numerous veterinarians practicing racetrack medicine
    indicated that many horses suffering various degrees of lameness,
    chronic respiratory interference or history of bleeding, often are
    entered and become starters in races at all levels of competition.
    Prior to entry many of these animals have been subjected to a variety
    of pharmaceuticals, surgical procedures, or other medical and training
    regimes 'to get them to the racetrack one more time'."
    
    

    I don't think the comparision of bute to aspirin for a headache is all
    that accurate in the case of a horse that HAS to have it EVERY time he
    is scheduled to be ridden. Do YOU take an aspirin EVERY morning before
    work because you KNOW that going to work without it will cause you to
    have a headache? If the answer is truly yes, have you not ever
    considered a change of careers? Certainly if you give your horse bute
    for a temporary cut it's a different senerio, as is taking aspirin
    for an occasional headache. I come to work every day becuase I have to
    for the financial rewards, presumably that is the same for most people.
    Does a horse HAVE to be ridden if doing so drug-free causes him pain?
    Does his ridability produce some sort of needed income for his owner?
    Certainly that is the case of most race horses (or the desired case,
    not all of them ever win any money :-)..But for myself, the fact the
    a horse can be ridden is one of the advantages for owning one, but not
    the reason for it. I wouldn't ride a horse that needed to be buted
    beforehand or else he would suffer pain (and if I've misunderstood
    this case and it is a "maybe he'll need it occasionally" thing rather
    than a "he defineatly needs it all the time" forgive me). I'd try to
    offer him a career change, and if that didn't work I'd turn him in
    the paddock daily as normal and have a big fat fuzzy pet who was cared
    for just as much as when he could be ridden comfortably. Just me, of
    course, I'm not implying that anyone in here is cruel or abusive,
    obviously if they take the time to read this notesfile, etc, they
    care a good deal about their horses.
     

    No, I don't take aspirin every day as a headache preventative but my
    mother-in-law who has arthritic hands has to take aspirin every morning
    so that she can use her hands and enjoy life. Many arthritic people DO
    take BUTE daily as my mother-in-law uses aspirin. Why is it so terrible to
    give a horse the same medication to make it comfortable enough to
    enjoy life?
    
    I do feel that it is in the horse's best interest in situations like
    those described earlier in this topic. However, I don't believe that it 
    is ethical to give a horse bute or any other medication to allow it to 
    COMPETE regardless of whether the sport is racing, dressage or tiddlywinks.
    
    BTW, the company that makes Bute is changing the name. The drug name is
    phenyl butazone or something like that. They had been leasing the name
    Butazolodin(or however it's spelled) from another company. They have
    decided to save money and terminate the lease. They are going to call
    it Phenyl...same drug new name

    I have read somwhere that taking bute long term may cause  ulcers.
    There is a horse in my barn who has been on low level of bute for 
    a year and seems fine. My concerns in all this is that my 20 year old
    Connemara has early stages of navicular (for now no bone damage but
    enlarged blood vessels). He is getting corrective shoes today (or
    tomorrow) and he is supposed to be on bute for a couple of weeks.
    Supposedly the corrective shoes don't always do the trick and then one
    can try bute on a more frequent or continuous basis. What are the long
    term effects of bute?
    
    Thanks, Ania

   the dangers of bute vary with the sensitivity of the individual. my
   large pony gelding spent ten days at rochester last autumn when he
   developed an intestinal ulcer after eight days on 2g bute 2xday. (that's
   a lot of bute, especially for a pony - we're still not sure why the vet
   prescribed that amount for that long).

   on the other hand, i had an old medium pony who spent the last years of
   her life on low levels of bute (1/2 to 1 tab 1xday) with no apparent ill
   effects.

   bute certainly can be dangerous, and can produce mouth, throat and
   stomach ulcers (usually the former two correlate with long term usage).
   do read up on usage and symptoms. however, used carefully, i still
   believe its benefits outweigh its risks.

   my first horse (also a connamara, strangely enough - they usually have
   such wonderful feet) had early navicular (that's how i got her - she was
   a wonderful mare who otherwise would have been $$$). Garth Bodkin kept
   her sound and happy (speaking of $$$ {-: ); you may find investing in
   the best farrier you can locate the best medicine in the long run.

   good luck with your gelding!

    HAS ANYONE EVER USED INFLAMX OR ENFLAMX INSTEAD OF BUTE?  IT IS
    SUPPOSE TO BE EASIER ON THEIR STOMACHS AND ALL NATURAL.  WE ARE
    THINKING OF TRYING IT ON OUR 8 YR OLD PAINT MARE WITH OSTE-ARTHRITIS.
    PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF ANYONE HAS TRIED THIS.
    		THX,
    		RALPH BLACK