Conference noted::equitation

    	I was just at Lindgren Lumber to pick up wood for my barn and I 
    remember seeing bales of shredded newspaper and a shredder.  This place
    is located in Holden, Mass.   Try calling them 508-829-9156
    
    	Gary

How much does dice-it cost per 'bale?'   I've never heard of this before.
Is the ink from the newspapers safe against the horse's skin?   I picture
a gray horse getting up from a nap with newspaper print all over his rump. :^)

Melinda

p.s. re .0  I'm sure you've already done this, but have you made sure your
	    horse's stall window is kept angled open at all times?  I know
            of so many people who shut their horse's stall windows all 
	    winter long thinking they're doing them a favor, when in
            actuality they are creating respiratory problems.

    
    
    Hi Melinda!
    
    My situation with each stall:  They do not have windows....each stall
    opens up to its own outdoor pen....pens are appx. 15 x 20... the
    majority of the year I have my dutch doors open so they will go in
    and out when they choose...(only for bad ice storms do I usually close
    it up).....I've moved my mare into the largest stall I have which is
    a 15X20 and is positioned to get a cross-wind through it since I have
    an extra dutch door set up opposite the door way to that pen....plus
    there is a lot of air circulation up by the ceiling as well....
    Obviously, there has never been a question about the air circulation
    in my barn.....but EXCELLENT POINT!  THIS ONE IS REALLY CRITICAL!
    
    
    I made a mistake on the name of the bedding....it's called "Dice a
    Bed"......they usually go for about $3.50 each but will go a long
    way when opened....
    
    Yah, I've used it in the past some years ago.....and with my mare
    (she's a red roan type of Appy.) you can almost read the print on
    her if she pees and then lays in it......
    
    This bedding is highly recommended by veterinarians since it is
    " non-allergenic ".......  I've never had a problem with it....
    and it doesn't have any dust!   Dust is one of the critical areas
    we are trying to control....and with all this air-circulation with
    my stalls being connected to dirt-floored pens...this can be an
    issue...especially if the sawdust gets outside and in the dirt!
    
    Ideally, a person should their horse outside all the time if they
    have this condition but my situation really doesn't allow for that
    too easily since I don't have any run-in type of shelter for the 90X180
    I have in the back yard......
    
    Thanks for the 2 responses!!!!!  I will call Holden, Mass. and
    check-it-out!
    
    By the way, the vet stopped in yesterday afternoon.....her temperture
    is down to normal and her breathing and heart rate have improved "100%"
    according to my vet.....we must be doing something right!!!!  My mare
    is still on a lot of medication including an expectorant and
    antihistimines......he drew blood and doing a white cell count to
    look for infection....we'll see from here!  Thanks again!

    I've tried the shredded paper and my appy mare had a terrible reaction
    to it...lots of coughing, runny nose and all over lethargy!!!  as soon
    as I changed back to wood shaving she got well.  Just so you'll
    know not all horses can use the paper... I also have rubber mats
    in  both stall which are walkouts, the horses are never enclosed.
    but the paper still bothered her so severely that the vet had to
    come out...
    
    caryl

    
    
    I too have stall mats in my stalls as well and have had them for
    years..it's helped with the dust in my stalls, certainly, but
    I suspect something in the sawdust.......
    
    It's only common sense to know that not all animals can tolerate
    something....each horse is an individual just as humans are....
    Why did you try your mare on the newspaper?  
    
    I was hoping there was some feedback out there that would give
    me some other ideas???????
    
    
    

    Hello!
    I've also heard this "Dice-a-bed" is good for allergic horses. My
    friend had an allergic horse, and she used either slightly moist
    peat-litter, or this "Dice-a-bed".
    Dice-a-bed is cheaper then peat-litter.
      Another thing that can make the reaction of the horse whorse is bad
    air. If it's too cold and draughty to keep the stable door or windows
    open all time, I can recommend an ventilator-fan. There are cheap ones
    that are easy to install. You don't have to keep the fan blowing day
    and night  - use a timer. This keeps the air fresh and nice and
    neutralize humidity.
      I guess you wet the hay before giving it to the horse? I've heard the
    owner of the stable where I keep my horse, is going to use "hay-silage"
    next year (not ensilage!). In some way the hay is kept moist since the
    harvest, without loosing any nutritive value. Then you can keep the hay
    in the stable without spreading any dust when handling it.
    I am not really aquainted with with this method - I've just heard about
    it, maybe it's something for you worth knowing...
    
    Addi.
    

    
    HI!
    
    Thanks for the message!!!!  I guess I didn't put enough detail in my
    original message......originally, my horse has had an on-again off
    again cough for the last few months.....due to my efforts of trying
    to control this....I took her off the majority of the hay I was feeding
    her and started to give her beet-pulp with her feed....then gave her
    a small half-flake of hay that was wet down.....this she has been on
    for a couple of months until this attack....It's so true.....bad air
    can be a real PROBLEM with especially a sensitive horse....fyi....for
    years I have been really picky....I clean the stalls morning and
    night..12 months a year so a lot of ammonia fumes don't have a real
    chance to effect my animals.....there is a good cross-wind in this
    stall she is in....but your idea around a ventilator-fan sounds
    logical to me.....
    
    I'm especially curious about this hay-silage that you
    mentioned.....right now my mare is on the beet pulp totally (no hay)...
    but I really have to bribe her to eat the stuff.....what I do is
    alternate layers in a bucket with charger, beet pulp and bran...
    then i microwave some honey, or molasses......and pour it in....once
    in a while, when I heat a small pan of water to dilute the steroid
    pills the vet has her on I'll throw in a candy cane too....this is
    a traditional treat my horses get on Christmas morning....they really
    smack their lips for it.....I am also giving her a granulated
    antihistimine and an expectorant (vanilla flavored)....all of this
    gets heavily soaked with warm water, allowed to sit for about 10
    minutes to absorb......I'm thinking, however, about something that
    appeals to her a little better than the beet pulp....she trys to
    avoid eating it (it's obviously not her favorite)...and I've been
    thinking about alfalfa cubes (soaked).....now you mention this
    hay silage (sp?)....I would appreciate it if you could find out
    more on the subject.....is this something they are doing with
    hay off of their own fields?  something they are purchasing?  anything
    at all on the process?
    
    Another point on the bad air.....my horse had this severe reaction
    from this scenerio:     on Friday and Saturday the temperate was
                            in the 50's.......
    
                            Saturday night it dropped to near 20 degrees!
                            
                            I did not shut her in the stall that night but
                            left it open to her pen which is customary....
                            The other horses were just fine but she was
                            in severe distress.....
    
    Another thing.....I had contacted a vet at Cornell University regarding
    this....she sent me some information that I received on Friday...it
    is more detailed than anything I have read yet.....the only problem
    for me is that it's not in laymans terms.....not to say I know nothing
    of medical terms after having horses since 1956....but, this stuff
    I need to use my medical encyclopedias and I'm sure my vet to help
    translate for me.....it gives besides observations of different
    horses sensitive and normal...it gives a run-down on treatment....
    specifically medication......my horse is on three of the appx. 6 or
    7 things listed....this helps me be able to ask more questions of
    my vet .......
    
    The mare is doing much better ....... my only worry is that it is
    the medication she is on rather than our controlling her environment...
    she had a pleasant weekend and was quite content running around with
    my other two in the back field on Saturday and Sunday......
    
    Thanks for the feedback!   
    
    Do you know where your friend purchased the "dice-a-bed"???????
    
    Have a good day and I hope we'll communicate again soon!
    
    
    

    Hello again!
    I haven't stumbled on"my" stable-owner recently, but as soon as I see
    him I'll ask more about this "hay-silage". I'll write again as soon as
    I receive some more information...
    
    Addi.f

    
    
    Thanks Addi!
    
    I'll be waiting here.....my mare is doing much better now.....and we
    have finished up the 10 day dosage of expectorant and antihistimine...
    we're weaning her off of the steroids right now so she's nearly done.
    
    I finally remembered to bring in the information that I received from
    my vet on heaves as well as Dr. Ainsworth at Cornell University if
    anyone is interested in the information.
    
    Sherri---I will be mailing you a copy today via interplant mail so
    watch for it....
    
    

         
    
    "Hay-silage":
    The hay doesn't need to be completely dry when they harvest it. The
    machine packs the hay very, very tight - making big round rolls.
    I's so tightly packed that the air is pressed out, and then they put
    airtight plastic around it.  Since this hay-package doesn't contain air
    (-oxygene), it doesn't rot, and it preserves the nutritive values.
    Another advantage is that this hay doesn't dust.
    
    According to the stable-owner this method isn't very rare... (Though I
    had not heard about it before he mentioned it).
    
    Addi.

    
    
    You might want to try putting regular hay in a hay net and then soaking
    it in a tub of water for a half hour or so before you feed it.  We used
    to do this when I worked at the track with race horses that had a problem 
    with the hay dust.  It cut down on the respiritory problems
    tremendously.  
    
    Pat     
    
    
    
    

    The soaked hay worked for my old gelding as far as the dust went.  The
    only thing we added was some sweet lime to the water.
    
    Due to the weight of the hay when it was soaked for a couple of hours
    my husband rigged up a pulley off the one of the rafters for me.
    In the morning I would fill a hay net and leave it sit in the water
    until the next feeding; pull it out on the pulley; hang it for the old
    guy and then fill another one for soaking for the next feeding.
    
    It worked well for him.
    
    GOOD LUCK
    Kathie
    

Mare with allergy to paper!!
    
    I usually use shavings, not sawdust, but have a friend who uses
    the paper and the cost for the paper is so much less, I thought
    I would give it a try.   You're right, everybody and animal is probably
    going to have something that will bother it.  Luckily, it was only
    an allergy that was easily corrected and nothing serious.
    
    Do you find sawdust too fine a texture and is it easily inhalable???
     Is sawdust cheaper than shavings??  
    
    I do find that now that I have the mats I use much less shavings!!!
    Good luck....
    

    I'm having trouble with my gelding not being interested in his hay.
     Unfortunately, he doesn't have access to grass and is fed hay year
    round.  someone mentioned alfalfa cubes.  Can this be fed instead
    of hay or in addition to.  I have also noticed my guy coughing after
    the last batch of hay, it did seem dusty.  The new batch is much
    better and he is fine now.  But I will remember the wetting down
    of dusty hay.
    
    Thanks for the tips.

    
    
    I don't find the sawdust too fine...I do use sawdust rather than the
    shavings and one reason is price.....right now I'm buying from a
    logging company.  It's costing me about $110 for a 3 1/2 cord load....
    This is a good size load and last me a good 4 to 5 months minimum with
    3 horses....(of course, now I am using the newspaper for one of the 3)
    
    By the way, folks, after all of this I have finally found a solution
    to my shredded newspaper issue....it seems that whomever made the
    dice-a-bed doesn't anymore....or at least all of the feedstores I've
    contacted throughout the area as well as the main headquarters for
    Blue Seal do not know how to acquire any of it anymore.....
    
    However, it turns out that a friend of mine, Roberta Bryant, who
    has Mt. Toby Stables in Leverett, Mass. (that's outside of Amherst)
    is buying some shredded newspaper from a manufacturer in New Hampshire.
    
    There are 2 types...cow bedding (it's dusty) and horse (no dust)....
    The bedding really fluffs up and one bale fills my 15X20 stall.....
    The horse bedding is appx. $2.25 per bale...(it depends on the quantity
    you buy)....I like it better than the dice-a-bed because the paper is
    finer and the urine is absorbed quickly.....it makes like a paper mache
    lump but it's easy to remove and you don't tend to easily throw any
    of the good stuff out with it.....evidently, other folks in the area
    that are involved with competitive trail riding (Mt. Toby has a lot
    of activity with competitive rides) are using this bedding and
    absolutely love it.....the paper even breaks down in your manure pile
    more quickly as well....the horse bedding that I have gotten has NO
    PRINT on it at all.....so no ink....it's much softer to lay on as
    well...it almost feels like cotton to the touch.....Roberta is working
    on being a distributor for this bedding in the area....if you have a
    need and are interested ....you can contact her .....413-548-9335......
    
    One old saying that I will always stand by is:  "if it isn't broken
    don't fix it".....
    
    With changing anything regarding a horse...if the horse is doing well
    as they are, be it feed, bedding, etc.....why change?  perhaps $$$
    could be a motivator for any and all of us .... and I can understand
    that....but I would not have changed over to this bedding if my mare
    hadn't been having a problem and had a need to make the change.....
    and I think I will continue because I'm very pleased with the
    results...  
    
    happy riding folks!!!
    

    how is this bedding diced up?? is it something that you use use old
    newpapers and put it into a shredder??
    
    
    		wendy o'
    
    
    

    Hi Wendy!
    
    I guess that's how they handle it....they put it into a shredder.
    I know the dice-a-bed has the ink on the paper, so obviously it was
    someones newspaper at one time.....this new stuff I'm buying doesn't
    have any print (for the horse)....the cow stuff does have print.....
    
    This new stuff is shredded much finer than the dice-a-bed....nice and
    comfortable for the horse......
    super absorbent...........

    
      I'm on the recycling Committee in Sterling Ma. We currently have two
    dairy farmers in town who take a large majority of the black and white
    newsprint we collect and shred it for bedding. Everybody wins because
    the town does not have to pay a tipping fee to dispose of the newsprint
    and the local farmers have access to a free supply of bedding material.
    
      As recycling catches on in town we will probably be looking for more
    sources to take the paper. We are educating the townspeople into
    sepparating their black & white newsprint from their other recyclable
    paper and this greatly helps the farmers because the biggest problem
    they have is in sepparating the paper.
    
     My questions are:
    
     1. Is their anyone in the Sterling, MA. area who would be interstested
    in obtaining newspaper/bedding ? My guess is that the farmers wouldn't
    mind someone taking excess shredded paper in exchange for helping them
    shred/sort some paper.
    
    2. If anyone would like to set up a recycling situation like we have in
    their community. Feel free to contact me and I can show you how Sterling
    recycles their paper. You may be able to set up something similar in
    your town. Our farmers are very receptive to showing people their
    operation and helping anyone else get started.
    
    3. Other than some horses may be allergic to paper bedding, is there
    any reason why you would not want to use this type of bedding.
    
    
      Bob

    Won't they get covered with ink if they lay down in it?  Is the ink
    toxic?  The paper treated with bleach?  I'm curious about long term
    effects that could be caused by the above.
    
    thanks,
    Mary

    
    
     > Is the ink toxic? 
    
    I'm not an expert, but I know that organic gardening approves the use
    of shredded newsprint in gardens. They say that lead is no longer used
    in the newsprint ink and that it is safe to use around things that you
    you grow to eat. 
    
     I don't know if the paper is bleached or not...We're researching this
    whole thing more within are recycling committee. I'll gladly post any
    findings that I come up with. I was just wondering if anyone out there
    with horses had already done some research.
    
    
     Bob
     

	So what do they do with the paper when they clean the stalls?
	Is it biodegradeable?

    
     re 'used paper'
    
     I'm told that the newspaper/manure mixture decomposes very quickly. The
    farmers plow it into their fields and the paper and manure condition the 
    soil. 
    
     Bob
    
    

    Does anyone know of a source of newspaper bedding in the Maynard area?
    A friend of mine is interested.
    
    -Andrea-