T.R | Title | User | Personal Name | Date | Lines |
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1384.1 | | DECXPS::LCOBURN | If it works, break it. | Mon Oct 29 1990 10:37 | 3 |
| I'm sure you mean the Breeders' Cup, where two horses had to be
destroyed. MY comments are unprintable, it only reinforces my
opinion of horse racing.
|
1384.2 | sadly enough | MTADMS::SOLLEY | | Mon Oct 29 1990 10:45 | 6 |
| Yes, whatever. I don't follow horse racing and don't condone it. As
the reason for not putting the comment in the racing note because those
readers love it. My husband called me in the room to watch, and when I
saw I screamed at him for not warning me as to what I was about to see.
Unfortunately the incident made me have nightmare regarding my own
horse.
|
1384.3 | | CSC32::M_HOEPNER | Standing on the edge is not the same | Mon Oct 29 1990 11:09 | 4 |
|
Would anyone care to fill us in on what happened?
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1384.4 | | ICS::CHIASSON | | Mon Oct 29 1990 11:42 | 18 |
| I didn't see the first 2 or 3 races, but from what I saw on the news
that night, in one of the first races, Mr. ?? threw up his head and
collapsed in the track (he later died of a heart attack). In one of
the later races (I can't for the life of me remember which one, I think
it was one of the mares' races), Go for Wand and Bayakoa were heading
for the finish line, and Go for Wand snapped a foreleg and was humanely
destroyed.
A day or two before the Breeder's Cup, one of D. Wayne Lucas' horses
had to be destroyed. Not sure what happened.
There's a lot of controversy going on regarding the condition of
Belmont's track for these races, though the jockey's seemed to think
that it was OK.
Only the rough details, someone else can fill in the rest.
|
1384.5 | | MSBCS::A_HARRIS | | Mon Oct 29 1990 12:00 | 13 |
| I was watching the race on TV when the filly snapped her foreleg. They
replayed the footage of her falling many times, and they even showed
the owners' and trainers' faces watching the accident. But, thank God,
they didn't replay the awful scene of the filly trying to run after her
leg was gone. It was the most gruesome, disgusting, heartwrenching
thing I have ever seen in my whole life.
I never make it a point to watch races, but my husband had it on. I
don't know if I can bear to ever watch another race again. Like the
trainer's wife said afterwards, they give up their lives for our
enjoyment.
-Andrea-
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1384.6 | Saw one once, Wish to never see it again... | USMFG::NROSTANZO | | Mon Oct 29 1990 12:20 | 7 |
|
I once witnessed a race horse break a leg at a small race track,
I had not bet but was watching that horse because she looked good.
So much for looking good.... . I can't bring myself to ever bet
a horse race again......... I'll stick to shows...
Nancy
|
1384.7 | percentages | NAC::SCHLENER | | Mon Oct 29 1990 12:45 | 16 |
| Have you ever thought of how dangerous eventing and grand prix jumping
is to the horse (and rider)? There have been times when a horse has
been put down due to an accident out on the course. I imagine some
cases were due to an injury caused out on the course which may have
later turned into something life threatening.
As far as racing goes, I don't want to see a horse put down. However,
how many times have horses been put down per equestrian sport (racing,
X-country, jumping, endurance).
Has anyone looked at percentages? For instance, is the percentage of horses
that had to be put down because of an injury from racing, any greater than
horses put down due to recreational riding/eventing/jumping??
Cindy
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1384.8 | Tragedy at Breeders' Cup | BOSOX::LCOBURN | If it works, break it. | Mon Oct 29 1990 13:57 | 7 |
| I'd imagine the percentage of both death and injuries
would be higher......few riding/eventing/show horses are
pushed so hard at such any early age. Hard to believe the
bones of a two-year old are really ready for the stress of
galloping full speed for a mile and a quarter.
|
1384.9 | Dangerous, but does the horse have a choice? | BOOVX1::MANDILE | | Mon Oct 29 1990 14:07 | 22 |
| .......The worst part of it is being a horse owner and
*knowing* exactly what the injury is, and then seeing
that poor filly get up and try to run....It brought on
nightmares, let me tell you. I was at a certain club's Polo
match years ago, and one of the horses was coming off
the field when it dropped right to the ground...heart failure.
They performed CPR, etc., but it was "no go". They draped
a tarp over him, and removed him after the crowd left.
I was working as a hot walker, so I got the real story...
A little "pepper-upper" was given to horses if they had
to do more than the normal amount of running, i.e. if the
stable was short a horse due to injury, than a horse would have
to do two Chukka's instead of one. Hence a shot of *speed*
to keep him going. This is the main reason I do not care
much for polo or racing, or those horse sports that over-exert
an animal, because of the abuse, bad treatment, etc. It's not
the sport, per say, but the running of sick/injured animals,
on bute, latrix, and who knows what else.......
L-
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1384.10 | to flame is better than not to flame... | MTADMS::SOLLEY | | Mon Oct 29 1990 14:15 | 10 |
| I think you hit the nail on the head, stating their bones aren't ready
for the stress. All my life I have listened to facts about their legs
not truely developed until four years of age, and if a horse really
were to have strong bones, they'd wouldn't be ridden until five. I
have never liked the fact that race horses are pushed as they are, at
two. So what if they have a lightweight on their back, it's simply
greed and single minded (in crowd) people who race them. Society
always wants better, and as usual health and welfare is lost. Whoops
I think I should have said, "flame on, flame off".
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1384.11 | More Breeders' Cup details and opinions | DECWET::DADDAMIO | Testing proves testing works | Mon Oct 29 1990 15:16 | 49 |
| I really like horse racing and there are a lot of people who do check
on bone strength and use heart monitors for conditioning, etc,
especially for stakes horses since they are worth so much money. The
one thing that keeps me from getting seriously involved in it is the
accidents that do happen.
I was glued to the TV on Saturday since I basically watch every race
that's televised on the regular networks (can't get cable). Here's
what happened in the races -
In the sprint coming into the turn, Mr. Nickerson leapt up in the air
and then went down. From what I heard and read, the vets think he
suffered a heart attack (which was the cause of him leaping in the air)
and died. His jockey, Chris Antley was thrown and suffered a broken
collar bone. Shaker Knit either jumped or stumbled over Mr. Nickerson
and went down, throwing his rider, Jose Santos. Santos was not hurt.
The vets got Shaker Knit to the hospital and last I heard he was lying
on his sternum, but unable to completely get up. They didn't know if
anything was broken or not. Apparently an accident like this could not
be blamed on the condition of the track (several people expressed this
opinion when the condition of the track was discussed).
In the distaff, Go For Wand was leading Bayakoa when her right ankle
snapped. Randy Romero went off over her head and was not injured.
From what I read in the paper, Go For Wand managed to make it over to
the outside rail before collapsing. I don't remember much from the TV
because I was crying so hard. She had to be put down. From what Randy
said in an interview later, she never had any leg problems. Maybe an
ultrasound test on her legs could have predicted this?? No one seemed
to know if this could have been caused by the track or not. D. Wayne
Lukas said he thought they should check the track, especially since
they had quite a few problems earlier that week and even the day
before. From interviews with the jockeys, they thought it was a safe
track.
(I will post the race results in the racing note (481)).
In my opinion, more monitoring should be done on the horses, but you
will get some owners who want to run the horses even when the trainers
say no. Also, this isn't the only sport where horses and people get
hurt or killed. There have been plenty eventing, show jumping,
driving, and endurance accidents, too. Dressage doesn't seem to have
the breakdowns while in competition, but many horses can't take the
rigors of training and the stress builds up gradually causing lameness
or back problems, etc.
One last thing - I think a major accident was bound to happen sooner or
later during the Breeders' Cup. It's just unfortunate that two
happened at the same time.
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1384.12 | Three casualties, unfortunately | OFFPLS::SPINGLER | I work to support my cat habit! | Tue Oct 30 1990 09:18 | 6 |
|
Shaker Knit had to be put down Saturday evening, (according to an AP
news wire report) due to an injured spine.
So sad.
|
1384.13 | GRAND NATIONAL | COMICS::PEWTER | | Tue Oct 30 1990 09:28 | 14 |
|
Have you US noters ever seen the Grand National? It's heartbreaking
and more often than not horses die on the track or are badly injured.
Jockeys too.
As far as showing, eventing etc. The Bradleys set a good example
with Milton. They will not allow him to be put at risk and rightly
so. They know his limits, won't take chances like letting him fly
to countries where he may catch an illness. He is a fabulously
talented animal and if allowed to be pushed to his full extent
would no doubt be unbeatable and worth even more. But to them
he is obviously priceless and I find it touching in this day and
age.
|
1384.14 | some thoughts | MSDOA::KRESSENBERG | | Tue Oct 30 1990 12:29 | 22 |
| Anyone watching the Go For Wand-Bayakoa duel had to be heartbroken at
the outcome. We would be doing the courage and desire of those two
mares a great disservice, however, to use this incident to indict the
entire sport of horseracing. There are bad trainers, crooked riders,
and unfit horses at every track, but I don't think any of those figured
in the Breeder's Cup tragedy.
I've been involved in foxhunting most of my life, and I've seen my
share of horses lamed and injured, though rarely destroyed as a result.
The reason is probably that at 20mph a misstep equals a bow or other
strain, while at 40mph it explodes the involved joint/bone. I've had my
own share of injuries, too, though none crippling - injuries to me or
my horse are a risk I've accepted, and I manage that risk as
intelligently as I am able.
Well, opening meet is Saturday, and the air is as crisp and cool as it
should be. When the master looses the pack, and we head for the first
cast, I know my horse's ears will be at attention and he'll haul at the
bit - he loves this stuff, he really does. I'll think of that filly and
admire her guts and know that anyone who's ever taken a deep seat and a
long haul to attempt something difficult and dangerous will feel the
same.
|
1384.15 | I grew up reading National Velvet | DECWET::DADDAMIO | Testing proves testing works | Tue Oct 30 1990 14:59 | 14 |
| Re: .13
I watch the Grand National every time it is televised over here. It's
amazing that more horses aren't hurt or killed than there are. I only
remember one horse being killed in the last several years and that was
a beautiful gray horse named Dark Ivy - must have been over three years
ago. Most of the times I've seen the Grand National less than half of
the field ever finishes and they usually start out with close to 40
horses in the race. One thing does stand out when you look at the
horses that race in steeplechases, they are all older horses and they
also seem to have more bone than the average flat racer. They need it,
too, because they carry more weight than the flat racers over longer
distances and with big jumps to negotiate. Seems like you have to have
a pretty sturdy horse to do that kind of racing.
|
1384.16 | | DELNI::KEIRAN | | Tue Oct 30 1990 15:03 | 25 |
| I believe it is really difficult to try to figure out why this
terrible tragedy happened. Worse than that though, in my opinion
is the fact that it happened on national tv, and people get the
wrong impression of horse racing. When you think of the hundreds,
maybe even thousands of racetracks across the country, both flats
and harness, and consider that they race 12-15 races a night with
anywhere from 8-14 horses per race, the percentage of injury is
a lot smaller than it would seem. Sure there are bad trainers in
horse racing, just as in every other horse related sport, just read
some of the notes in this file for example!! Wherever there is money
to be made, there will be bad apples, we all know that.
The last reply put it best, a good racehorse loves the game, and
without a good winning attitude, you don't have a shot. I am not
trying to defend what happened this weekend, but accidents do happen.
I don't believe in racing horses at 2 years old, I don't think they
are well developed either physically or mentally for that. You have
to remember too that when that horse fell, she was flat out, going
as fast as she could go and pumped full of adrenaline which is most
likely the reason she got up and kept going. One thing about New York
also, they are extremely strict on drug use, they drug test before
and after the race and if you are caught using something, you can be
banned from racing for many years.
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1384.17 | what? | BONJVI::PIERCE | I've fallen and I can't get up | Tue Oct 30 1990 15:27 | 14 |
|
I watched the race also and I could not belive it! I allwasy watch the
races..and I have never seen anything like this..I was speachless.
Let me get this right..go for wand and Baykoa (sp) were the 2 fighting
it out in the end..and Go for wand broke her ankle? I did'nt think
anything happed to her. the only weird thing I noticed eas Bayoka
jumping the shadows on the groud like they were steapls or somthing.
I thought it was 2 horses in the back of the pack that got hurt..
Please help me get this right
louisa
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1384.18 | Different race | DECWET::DADDAMIO | Testing proves testing works | Tue Oct 30 1990 18:05 | 11 |
| Re: .17
Louisa,
You're confusing the Go For Wand/Bayakoa race with the first race that
was run, which was the sprint. It was Safely Kept and Dayjur in that
race and Dayjur jumped the shadows. Two horses in the back did get
hurt in that race. The third race was the one where Go For Wand broke
her ankle. Hope that straightens it out for you.
Jan
|
1384.19 | Such a waste....... | DNEAST::BUTTERMAN_HO | | Wed Oct 31 1990 11:08 | 24 |
|
RE; all....
I am so glad that I was busy keeping an eye on my weanling
filly, who was spending her 2nd day away from mom... and not
watching the races. I guess I did look to see if they were on
non-cable TV and couldn't find anything.......................
I will never be able to get the picture of Ruffian out of my
mind during her match race when she suffered the same fate. I
wish that they'd wait till the babies (2/3 year olds) had grown
enough so that their bones had closed up.. It has got to make a
difference. I'm not against racing, I just wish that the risks
associated with such young animals could be taken into greater
consideration.
The thoroughbreds heritage make them such great animals, I
respect them highly. I understand folks desire to be actively
involved in racing (as I am in breeding and showing). I couldn't
do it...
It feels a waste to see such quality GONE ... that's all.
|
1384.20 | | BOSOX::LCOBURN | If it works, break it. | Wed Oct 31 1990 11:23 | 11 |
| My sentiments exactly, unfortuneatly it's not economical for breeders,
trainers, whoever, to allow their potential race horses to grow
up before using them. If they race at 2, how young are they when
training begins, yearlings? It's really a shame. I'm not opposed
to racing, either, but merely the use of such young animals. If
they'd wait until the horse could mature I'd have nothing against
it at all. I think a lot of people feel that way, unfortuneatly
money makes the world go around, and feeding an inactive horse
for 4-5 years is not what the (majority) trainers are interested
in.
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1384.21 | thanks | BONJVI::PIERCE | I've fallen and I can't get up | Thu Nov 01 1990 14:44 | 8 |
|
Thanks for the clairfication! I got it now!
I to remeber Ruffain..it was in 1978..I was 14..I still have the
news paper about the race..I dont know why I've kept it, but I
will never throght it out
Louisa
|
1384.22 | | DELNI::KEIRAN | | Thu Nov 01 1990 15:03 | 3 |
| RE: Last
Wasn't it earlier than '78 or am I just feeling really old!! *8^}
|
1384.23 | 75? | REGENT::WIMBERG | | Mon Nov 05 1990 09:44 | 4 |
|
I believe it was 15 years ago which would make it 75 - same track
but on the backstretch.
|
1384.24 | Ruffian | COOKIE::ACKERMAN | Two GSDs, 1 Kees, & a 1/4 of a horse | Thu Nov 08 1990 15:44 | 9 |
| All this discussion has reminded me of the Ruffian - Foolish Pleasure
Match race, too. I can still remember what Ruffian looked like after
being injured.
My sister was at Belmont two weekends ago watching the Breeder's Cup.
She watched the horses go down and was so sickened by the whole thing
that she left and went home.
--Laura
|
1384.25 | Autopsy on Mr. Nickerson answers some questions. | GENRAL::LEECH | NEVER assume anything. | Mon Nov 26 1990 18:18 | 27 |
|
Mr. Nickerson, one of theree horses which lost their lives in the Oct.
27 Breeders' Cup at Belmont Park, suffered acute pulmonary (lung)
hemorrhage and a fractured right humerus (upper foreleg) during the
Sprint (gr. I) according to an autopsy released by the New York State
College of Veterinary Medicine. It had been speculated that the
stakes-winning sprinter died of a heart attack.
According to the autopsy, Mr. Nickerson's heart was normal. Dr. Robert
Fritz, whose veterinary firm treated the colt before his death, said
that Mr. Nickerson actually died from pulmonary hemorrhage, meaning
that the horse bled to death. Dr. Fritz said that Mr. Nickerson
fractured his humerus when he fell after the initial onset of the
bleeding problem.
"About three-eights of a mile into the race, he threw his head up
suddenly," said Dr. Fritz. "That is a symptom of a horse that is not
getting any oxygen. The reason would be that his lungs were filling up
with blood."
Other veterinarians, however, have said that the colt might have broken
his leg first, which caused the bleeding.
The BLOOD HORSE, dated Nov. 24, 1990.
|