Conference noted::equitation

    Jan,
    
    I have found that vacuuming them everyday, as part of your grooming,
    really helps to keep the dust level down.  Also as a final touch, fold a
    bath size towel in fours and "beat" them with it (strong, swift strokes
    to their body).  Another word for it is a 'wisp".  This really helps
    with dust and makes their coat shine.  Because the beating motion
    stimulates the blood and brings the natural oils to the surface.  It
    also helps with toning.  If you key into certain areas that really
    show off a great shine like; neck , shoulders, hips and rump, they
    will look great for the show season.
    
    Good luck :-)
     

    Hi Jan!

	Gee, I have a very playful TB who's now 9 and still doesn't have alot
   of smarts when it comes to other horses.  He's always trying to instigate
   "playtime" and doesn't believe the other horses warning or attacks -- he
   gets this surprised look on his face after an attack.  

	What helped my guy the most was turning him out with a very patient
   pony who taught him not to crowd and general manners.  There are still
   some horses I will not turn my horse out with as they either have short
   fuses or just don't like him.  I have noticed that 3 in a paddock (him
   being one of the 3) is the max -- otherwise it turns into a "horsey in 
   the middle" kicking battle with guess-who in the middle.

	I would suggest you boot him, lay in a supply of vetwrap, spray-
   furizone, betadine, etc.  If possible ask where you board if you could
   turn him out with one other horse for a while, then add another, etc.
   Each addition will be traumatizing as the pecking order will need to be
   re-established.

		Good luck!
				-Caroline

    How many hours of pasture time does he get. if he only get a couple,
    perhaps it's not enough. Your horse may look at his pasture time as a
    special treat rather than part of his routine.
    		Cindy
    

    I had a QH mare that acted as you described. The only way to keep her
    unscratched enough to show was separate turnout. They would yell back
    and forth but as soon as you put them together the bald spots or kicked
    legs appear.
    Sandy
    

    
    Having had horses receive some pretty bad injuries from their buddies 
    I am very conservative turning horses out together.  
    
    I certainly would see if you could turn him out with just one horse
    for a while (or forever if possible) since the paddocks are not real 
    large.

    Hi All,
    
    re: .3
    
    he's turned out all day and all night if the weather permits.  If its
    inclement, he gets about 6 hours out with his blanket on.  The amount
    of turnout doesnt seem to matter in regard to how playful he is.
    
    i just talked with the barn manager and we will be able to put
    him in a paddock by himself if this doesnt clear up within the next
    few days.  while i feel that i'm going to solve the immediate problem
    and get him healed up, i was hoping I could eventually turn him
    out with others (most specifically my other horse thats older but
    as one barn manager put it 'no pansy').  is this something that
    possibly calms down with age?  i have the felling that its not......
    
    jan
    

    Age has little to do with herd status and agressiveness. The mare that
    was getting beat up was 15 hands and 15 years old, the one doing the
    damage was 14 hands and 24 years old....I now have 3 horses, 4
    paddocks, and 2 pastures. I cannot chance putting everyone together but
    two together works ok in the pasture but not the paddock.
    It really is an art.......
    Sandy
    

    
    oh, lord.  one more battle to face.....
    
    its a good thing i get so much joy out of riding these creatures.
    and the baby is an *absolute* joy to ride.  this is the second
    horse i've owned and if i wasnt totally hooked before, i am now!
    I never dreamed it could be this rewarding teaching a horse
    new 'tricks'.  I'd always relied  on my old faithful to teach
    me the ropes rather than the other way around.  however, if you
    hear of a show with a rider on a 'bald wonder' think of me....
    
    its almost as bad as having children and certainly as expensive.
    (I've never had a pair of custom made shoes in my life, but my
    horse does.  I couldnt afford private tutors in college, but guess
    who gets them now....ahhhh, priorites.  how they change).
    
    jan
    

    Age doesn't help.  Just ask my 25 year old gelding who's a complete
    pest.  But I suspect limiting his playmates will help - especially
    if you put him out with a mare or two.  They have this way with
    errant youngsters.
    
    My boys play pretty rough, too.  But outside of some missing fur,
    they don't hurt each other.  I do limit the number of critters I put
    out together. In confined areas they get bored an harass each other.
    And I watch them to make sure things don't get too out of control.
    
    On the other hand, we had a real nice Trakehner die while playing
    with a buddy.  They used to charge at each other (playing chicken?)
    and one day they ran into each other.  There was a loud "crack"
    and the horse broke his sternum (which punctured a lung) and you
    can imagine the rest. That was the last horse I ever sent away to
    a trainer.
    
    			-maureen
    
    
    

    I am wondering about pulling the rear shoes...does that really limit
    the damage much?? I am (hopefully!) bringing our TB gelding home
    to live with my Stdbrd mare sometime this summer, after the riding
    ring is done. They will have their own 12 X 12 box stalls, but share
    a small paddock (about 1/2acre) to which my mare currently has free
    access. I had hoped to allow them both free access, but have wondered
    if they'll adapt to sharing the paddock. The gelding is a real sweetie
    with other horses, has never been a problem at the boarding stable
    he is at now, but the mare is a bit of a snot with others. I have
    seen her kick at others being ridden if they come right up on her
    butt, and she has always made nasty faces and squealed when sniffing
    noses. I guess I could keep one in while the other is out, but sharing
    sure would be nice! A friend had recommended pulling the rear shoes,
    but I can imagine that a well-placed kick could do damage shod or
    not....
    

	IF your mare hits what she aims at and has grows quality hoof, you
	may save yourself alot of grief by pulling her hind shoes.  

    My very trusting gelding let a nasty-faced mare back into him and kick 
    - got him dead center in the gaskin leaving a nice 2" slice (any lower or 
    higher & he'd probably would have had a broken leg).  Did my horse *learn*
    anything from this incident??  Nope.  (Dumb...)  The mare grew quality
    hoof, was only being used for trail rides at that time, plus her excellant
    aim (she always connected with whatever she aimed for) permitted her going
    barefoot behind.

    I still have my gelding and he's still too trusting for his own good, he
    has shoes on the rear and is turned out with other, non-aggressive horses.
    He may raise his hiny in warning, but very rarely will he kick out -- 
    I've only seen it happen once when he was being terrorized by another
    gelding.  ( I opened the gate, yelled, and he dashed through the gate a
    very relieved critter. )

    I, too, am planning on bring my horse home this summer.  I am also planning
    on 2 paddock areas -- that way I can isolate a new comer or an injured or
    an agressive horse.  

	Good luck!!

				-Caroline

    Gee, I always seem to be entering depressing notes...  Last month
    I had to put my dream horse down because he was kicked in the
    fetlock joint while turned out with two other geldings.  
    
    I've waited a LONG time to buy a horse, and finally this fall I found
    the perfect one.  Smy was a 16.3 h, bay TB gelding, trained up through
    2nd level, and a sweet heart to work around.  We were turning him out
    with two other geldings, one of which was young and extremely 
    boisterous.  Smy had a few nip marks and such, but he seemed to hold
    his ground, and I could tell he REALLY liked being turned out with
    others. (Turned out alone he would stand at the gate, waiting to come
    in.)  Just before Christmas I got a call at work from the barn, saying
    he'd been kicked pretty badly.  
    
    To make a long sad story short, he had a fractured fetlock joint, with
    two large bone chips traveling around the joint, causing a lot of
    trauma.  The vet said even if the chips were surgically removed, the
    joint would be so weak that he couldn't ever be worked, and he would 
    never be sound without the surgery.  So there really wasn't any other
    choice...  
    
    Moral:  If you feel your horse is getting picked on, be on the safe
    side, and try removing the offending critters from the paddock.  Maybe
    nothing would ever happen, but I wouldn't wish my broken heart on
    anyone else.
    	- Kate

    They are certainly all different.  We have a grand assortment...one
    paddock contains three mares ranging from a year to 30 years and one
    gelding.  We try never to put more than one gelding in a paddock if
    there are mares in it...some of them do get protective.  The other
    paddock has three mares for now with the third containing three
    geldings which includes a recently gelded stallion.  There are
    definitely a few bumps and lumps but those are few and far between
    right now.  It probably has something to do with the size since they
    can all get out of each others' way; however, they do have a tendency
    to gather around the gate.  They really are funny....the three mares
    and the gelding spend the majority of their time in about a quarter of
    an acre when they have easy access to three more acres.
    
    Good luck with whatever you decide to do...they are social animals even
    though it may not seem that way.  What would we do without them...I
    love them all.
    

    Removing the hind shoes of kickers is a good idea. The severity
    if injuries from unshod kicks is much less severe than with shoes.
    Think about what it feels like to get stepped on by a shod and unshod
    horse.
    
    Also a lot of breeders remove the hind shoes from mares before
    they introduce a stallion.
    
    Has anybody noticed that mares and geldings play different?  Mares
    seem to do a lot more kicking with the hind end, while the boys
    spend more time biting and rearing.
    
    
    

    My gelding was turned out into a three section field with 14, YES,
    that was 14!, other geldings.  Luckily, the field was big enough
    and he was not a pansy!!!! So he could avoid getting hurt, other than 
    a few bald spots and 1 cut.  I didn't like the idea of this many
    together, but when you board, what can you do?  I used to work there
    on weekends, and I would turn him out only with another quiet horse
    in the ring.  He could hold his own!  Only two horses were ever
    injured in this group.  One was the owners draft gelding.  He was
    too big to move quick enough, but he liked to roughhouse.  He was
    kicked and his front leg was broken.  Cost them $$$ to fix it.
    Another time, a strange gelding was turned out with the group, and
    the group ran him into the shed and sliced open his shoulder.  Only
    a few stitches, but he was there to leave for a dressage show with
    a group of boarders & the owner!
    I believe in no more than three together, and only if they have
    the same personalities.  One ex-racehorse was very mean and bossy.
    If they had left him out of the group when a new horse was introduced,
    it would have gone better for that horse.
    There were less injuries when hind feet were unshod.  The draft
    got it from a shod hoof.
    Now that mine is home and alone, only minor biffs once in a while!
    
    L-