Conference noted::bicycle

    Hi len,  
    
    Please don't shout (I find Capitals agressive and hard to read)
    
    I am always *very* nervous about any pain in or around the knees.  It
    could be just muscle pain but it could be something else.
    
    If you are relatively new to cycling it could be that you dont (yet)
    have the neccesary musculature to hold the knee-cap in position.. or
    anything.  If the position of the setup is relatively new, take things
    easy at first and let your body get used to it.
    
    There are many people wityh *much* more experience than I in here who
    will be able to give more info.  Or you could go to see a sport physio
    or doctor who could recommend a course of weights (if needed).  but
    thats sounds a bit drastic.
    
    For myself I am never sure through the clouded eyes as my heart tries
    to leap out of my chest and my lungs are screaming for mercy precisely
    where the pain is, but i *think* its the quads which hurt most.

    
    
    Hinault's position will almost definately be considerably higher than
    you rode previously. It sounds like the muscle around the knee i
    getting stretched more than it should. If the change is drastic,
    you're putting the strain on too quickly. Think of it as only having
    ever ridden 10 mile time trials then trying to do a sub 4-hour 100
    century.
    
    Move to that position slowly, gradually stretching to the position.
    Burning inside the knees is not natural...
    
    Graham.

     I'll second the responses. Pain is nothing to fool with in the
    knee area. Generally it means damage is being done, period. This
    is true even with muscles. The pain is associated to the tearing
    of tissue. Without it, muscles could not become stronger or more
    efficient.
    
     If you're feeling anything except in the quads (or occasionally -
    depending on what I'm doing - the calves) there's a good chance
    something isn't right.
    
     Have we scared you enough yet??? :-)
    
         Chip

    
>>     If you're feeling anything except in the quads (or occasionally -
>>    depending on what I'm doing - the calves) there's a good chance
>>    something isn't right.
    
	What about the lungs?  :*)
    
    Graham.    

>    THE QUESTION I WOULD LIKE TO ASK IS WHERE SHOULD MY LEGS BURN
>    WHILE RIDEING REALY HARD?

    Actually they shouldn't burn.... at least not the same as in
    other high-force low-rev sports.  Tired legs get more of a
    diffuse soreness as well as a generally weak feeling.  

    I would recommend downshifting.

    -Jeff

do you know if there is a bike shop around that offers "bike fitting" services?
ask wayne. he'll know. there's something called the "Fit-Kit" which is a bike
sizing method with special fitting devices sold by bill farrell in new
hampshire. stores buy the kit and (i believe) become certified in it's use and
then use it to fit people to their bikes. you pay a fee to the dealer for this
service. of special interest to you is the Rotational Adjustment Device (RAD).
this is used to set the angle on the cleats on your shoes assuming you're using
cleated shoes. misaligned cleats are *GUARANTEED* to cause knee problems.

are you in canada? i don't know if they have fitkit there.

>BURN AROUND THE INSIDE OF MY KNEES.
      ^^^^^^

by "inside" do you mean inside the joint itself  or inside in the sense of the
part of your knee toward the top tube.  if you mean inside the joint (as i
believe the others understood you) then you should lay off a little, start slow
and watch that you aren't trying to push gears that are too high. to see if
you're pedaling too high gears count your pedaling cadence. you should get
between 80 and 100 rpms. this will be slower when you're climbing a hard grade.
one revolution is one full revolution of the crank. ie count right foot or left
foot - not both.

ps. did a DIR/TITLE=FIT

">" indicates notes that may be of interest to you

>  186  WARLRD::JBINGHAM      8-DEC-1986     5  Fit Kit frame fit?
>  188  BIRMVX::DONNELLY     18-DEC-1986    13  Fit Kit and Frame size help.
   267  JACUZI::DESHARNAIS   14-APR-1987     7  Any bicycle clubs around Fitchb
   447  CADSYS::CRABB        28-AUG-1987    13  Health and Fitness Festival Bik
>  607     NAC::CAMPBELL      6-APR-1988    20  Bike fit questions?
   735  SCOMAN::DESHARNAIS   17-JUN-1988     6  BMX racing in the Fitchburg are
   758  NEADEV::ROBERTS       5-JUL-1988    22  LONGSJO CLASSIC FITCHBURG
>  826   USMFG::GHIGGINS     16-AUG-1988     1  " Fit Kit Question "
>  892  CIMNET::LUISI         4-OCT-1988     8  Self fit kitting?
>  945   WMOIS::C_GIROUARD   20-DEC-1988    15  $$$$FIT KIT$$$$
  1298  TKOV50::ZORBAS       28-AUG-1989    11  EXERCISE and FITNESS
  1347   WMOIS::C_GIROUARD   20-OCT-1989    10  TOUR DE TRUMP/FITCHBURG?
  1554  MILKWY::CRITCHLOW    22-MAY-1990     9  Help on Pedal retrofit
> 1695  MEO78B::SHERRATT      9-AUG-1990     1  Fit Kit and RAD Questions
  1786  IDEFIX::HEMMINGS     23-NOV-1990     5  Winter keep fit efforts....
  2251    GOLF::OSBORN       21-APR-1992     7  a car to fit the bike
  2394  RANGER::SCHLENER     26-AUG-1992     3  route needed through Leominster
  2467  KRAKAR::WARWICK      30-NOV-1992     0  Fitness Fickleness

    
     Lungs, Graham? Never... Ti transplants :-)
    
         Chip

    Sorry for shouting. The burning pain is in the inner thieghs,just above
    the knees.this is the area where i noticed the most muscle development 
    over the season .there is no pain in the inside of the knees. Over the 
    season i gradually built up to 25 miles night and one long ride on the
    weekend, usually around 60 miles. I averaged about 17 mph over rolling
    hills(nothing major). I don't think it is a knee conditioning problem,
    but i am going to check my cleets out carefully. Thanks for the input.

    
    Chip,
    
    	Why don't I struggle to believe that? Course, up here, our lungs
    are specially designed to take very small breaths because of the frozen
    air. That's my excuse for always being out of breath after a run
    anyway...   :*)
    
    Graham.

    That's an important muscle to develop -- the one on the inside of the
    upper leg.  It's the VMO (short for something more or less Latin)  it's
    purpose is to keep the patella in place properly balancing the pull
    from the other muscles. A typical cyclist injury requiring therapy
    occurs if the other quad muscles are too developed, much more than the
    VMO, the knee cap isn't held in place and you get problems.
    
    ed