Conference noted::bicycle

    	Rod,
    
    	I commented after RAAM '91 (with John Lee Ellis) that it
    	would have been a real asset. There was a lot of climbing
    	in all kinds of weather. John is/was fairly conservative
    	(in riding style) and was not comfortable changing clothes
    	on the move.
    
    	On the other hand, Ed Kross (RAAM '92) very seldom stopped
    	for anything other than pit stops. He was quite adept at
    	riding with no hands.
    
    	I asked Ed and Jay (another CAT III USCF racer) about it, and
    	Jay said it's just part of being a racer. He said you don't
    	have time to stop and do whatever, so you learn to do it on
    	the move. Jay also mentioned (as did Rod) that a headset in
    	good shape was important.
    
    	Me? I have enough trouble riding with hands. 8-)>
    
    	scott

I can remember doing it quite regularly when I was in my teens, but these days
I don't seem to be able to do it.  The wheel turns of its own accord and I go
all over the place.  Even a new bike with a good headset doesn't seem to make
it as easy as it once was.

Rich

    
    	Is that easier or harder than bunny-hopping on the rear
    wheel of your MTB while giving the peace sign?
    
    	Roger

In my experience, the ability to ride no-handed depends a lot on the
bicycle.  I used to have no problem on my old three-speed, when my
new bike was impossible.

-Jeff

    
    
      Riding no hands on the road is not to tough.  I do it mostly to rest
    my shoulders and stretch out my back a little on long rides.  The
    faster your going the easier it is to ride with no hands.
    
      If you want to show off then do it while your riding rollers!
    
    
      John C.
    

    
    
    For me, the bike has alot to do with it.  The differences seem to be in
    the frame (my observation).  One with very little rake in the fork or a
    steep head tube angle would seem to be tougher than the opposite.
    
    I had a steel 57cm steel bike that was impossible (crit set-up).  I now
    have a 60 cm carbon/aluminum road frame--relatively easy.
    
    r�

I ride no-hands (on the road) for short periods every now and then. To get a
cookie out of a bag in a jersey pocket, for example. I don't like to cruise
around no-hands. I got something out of a zippered under-the-saddle bag
recently, which was a challenge (slightly bent posture mad it harder than
when sitting straight).
						-- Tom

    It took me 20 or so years to learn to ride a bike, another 20
    or so to learn to ride out of the saddle, I imagine I've got
    another 15 or so to learn this specialty.
    
    ed

My headset is one of those new indexed headsets. Less than two thousand miles 
and it started to get notched. Dura-Ace...???

I will be replacing it this winter with a roller bearing headset. 

The notched headset with heavy STI levers equals tricky hands off riding. But
I still find myself riding no hands to pull my arm warmers off. Although lately
I've resorted to biting the ends and pulling them off that way. When I unzip my
jersey, I'll bite the collar and pull the zipper with the free hand.

	I use to do it quite often to remove jacket, mess with food, etc.
	but since I added aero bars, the front end balance has really
	changed.  Haven't gotten my no-hands skills back, not sure I 
	really want too.  Definitely getting better with 1 hand and 
	teeth ;^)

Paul

As .6 points out the fork rake and head tube angle are the most important 
criteria for stability. Angular momentum of the wheels is of some importance 
as well. So those old steel rims and big fat tires were good for something 
after all.

                                      John

    
    Headset and frame design are important. If, you've got tight frame
    geometry, the bike is more 'nervous' than a laid back frame.
    
    I used to be able to take my jersey off while riding rollers, but old
    age has got me a tad more sensible...
    
    Graham.

     I guess I do it for most of the reasons listed except changing
    clothes... I wait until I get home to that :-)...
    
     The Merlin handles well hand-less. No problems. I never had a problem
    with my C-Dale either (road frame geo..).
    
     Chip

    Riding with no hands will show if your bike is tracking good. if you
    frame is bent a little you will feel the bike pulling one way or the
    other. You have to learn the nohands if you want to be good at long road
    racing. You recieve your food in a bag, you have to take it out and
    drop the bag in a very short distance. This way your help can get the
    bag and fill it up again. I have seen people try using one hand
    taking out food and getting the bag caught in there front spokes.
    
     Mike.
    
    P.S. How can you do the wave on the bike, with out taking your hands off
    the bars. (Tour De France had a wave)

>    P.S. How can you do the wave on the bike, with out taking your hands off
>    the bars. (Tour De France had a wave)

You mean two arms in the air as the winner crosses the line? I think the
UCI tried to ban riders from doing that this year, but that's a very killjoy
attitude.


Rod

    
    When I was younger I used to not only be able to ride no handed but
    also backwards with out hands!! Of course that was on a BMX bike 
    but, still a challenge.   I still ride no handed quite often now on
    my Univega, usually to stretch my back, rest my hands or get a drink
    of water... 
    
        Dan

RE: <<< Note 2432.15 by JURA::PELAZ::MACFADYEN "Getting and spending" >>>

The wave et. al.

ESPN's coverage had as a background to an announcement a 10 second shot of a
group of riders doing the wave: Just cycling along, then everyone raises their
arms for a moment. Wait a second, then do it again, then again. Total of three
or four repeats. I thought it was pretty funny. I believe it was on the final
stage, where all sorts of craziness occurs.
						-- Tom

I learned to ride with no hands on the rollers last winter out of shear necessity.
I was sweating so badly that I had to use a towel with 2 hands to dry my head & face.
The key was to shift to a more difficult gear so that I could maintain my balance. 

I now find that I ride for minutes at a time on the road without using my hands.  
I find that it improves my balance and my ability to absorb bumps.

Ray

    
    
    Re.15 (UCI ruling)
    
    	The official UCI rule is that you can only raise your hands if you
    are more than 1 second clear. I think it was the 1988 Milk Race this
    was brought up when the Belgian commisaire disqualified a rider (I
    think it was 7-Eleven's Alex Stieda) because he won a two man sprint.
    Then on a later stage a rider only just avoided disqualification when,
    after checking the photo finish tape, his lead was put at 1.6 seconds.
    I'm not joking!
    
    	It's one of those rules that a few (ambitious?) commisaires think
    should be obeyed to the letter, but most are willing to turn a blind
    eye.
    
    Graham.

>ESPN's coverage had as a background to an announcement a 10 second shot of a
>group of riders doing the wave: Just cycling along, then everyone raises their
>arms for a moment. Wait a second, then do it again, then again. Total of three
>or four repeats. I thought it was pretty funny. I believe it was on the final
>stage, where all sorts of craziness occurs.
    
    I Remember it well.  14 July 1989 A stage to Marseille.  During the
    playing around in the morning somebody handed one of the peleton a
    bugle - he would play a fanfare and the whole peleton would then go
    hands off.  Very impressive. 
    
    This got no coverage in the UK but for some reason last year they dug
    out that footage for the intro to the tour coverage.
    
    I'll look up my videos if I remember and see if I can `name that bugler'
    
    PS Barteux took at it 50 seconds from Colotti after a break by Fignon &
    Mottet was pulled in pretty close to the finish.

    
>>    I'll look up my videos if I remember and see if I can `name that bugler'
    
	Thierry Marie?
    
    Graham.

A couple of years ago I saw an article in a magazine where a rider was so good
at riding without hands that used his arms to push his legs around.  This 
would gain him extra speed.  I believe he steered by gluing two pieces of 
string to the handlebars and then placing the ends of the string in his mouth.
If he wanted to turn right he would turn his head to the right, if he wanted to
turn left he would turn his head to the left.

I wonder what happened to him?  Perhaps he is lying in a ditch somewhere.

Nigel.

    
    
    I remember seeing an article where a guy rode his bike sitting on the
    handlebars with his back to the way he was travelling. He used a whole
    pile of mirrors to see where he was going.
    
    But the best is still to come. What did he have on his saddle? A TV
    connected to a 12v car battery!  No kidding!
    
    Graham.

The pedal with your hands on your legs and steering the bike with strings 
to the mouth happened to be a prank. It was an April fools gag.

I think the "doctor" that designed this technique was called "__boffo". I forgot
the first part of the name, but boffo was the ending. Dr Success??? Hardly.

Tom

    
    
    Re.19 (UCI ruling)
    
    	I looked through CYCLE_RACING and it was Alex Stieda in the '89
    Milk Race. I don't know the 2nd 'near-incident' rider but it was
    definately the Lincoln stage on the Michaelgate finish and I think it
    was a Czech. But, that is the one stage there isn't a result for (Stage
    10).
    
    Graham.

	What do you mean, no-hands.

	I watched part of the World championship 'artistic cycling' on television
	last saturday. Those people don't NEED hands: they stand on the saddle,
	cycle upside down in ways unexpressable in english for me, do a duo
	act where one is standing on the saddle and the other is sitting on
	the shoulders (of the first one) etc.
	I decided they must have some 'trick' bicycles. Anyway, it's a kind of
	magic no-hands.

						Jan  

    Look Ma, nohands, look Ma, no feet, look Ma, no teeth. Say about 50
    years ago I was first riding bikes. Rode one to school every day for
    all of jr & sr high school.  School was about 4 miles from home.  My
    buddies and I could ride the whole distance (and frequently did) no 
    hands.  We had these 26" heavy bikes with 22psi balloon tires.  Talk
    about laid back machines.  They took a bit of people power as well, but
    they were ultra-ultra-stable.  One could steer them easily with gentle
    shifting of your weight.  The only time it was really necessary to use
    your hands was for some quick change of direction or avoiding stones or
    trolley car tracks.  Another thing about those old frames was that the 
    rider's center of gravity was quite a bit lower than on modern
    machines.  Since I have been riding 10 speed's, riding no hands is
    something I will try only for the shortest of distances.  The MTN bike
    is a lot better in this regard, but nowhere up to the balloon tired
    monsters.  Hmmmmmm, I would like to try one again sometime, just to
    get the feel of how it used to be.
    
    Nostalgia Bill