Conference noted::bicycle

    Porcs are supposed to be great for traction- due to design and
    composition. Also tend to wear quickly, according to MBA and others.
    
    I have replaced my Ritchey MegaBite in the rear with a Smoke. I'm
    happy enough with it, but honestly don't feel a major difference.
    Supposedly they will give you better cornering grip, due to their
    design. 
    
    I think that MBA did a comparison on all the major brands, about a
    year ago, you might want to check that out if you can.
    
    My personal opinion: Why agonize over a component choice? If you ride
    like yoy should be riding, they are just going to break or blow
    anyways!
    
    -Ed

	My S.O. has a Raliegh Assault (frame too small to measure 8^)
	with 24" wheels...has anyone ever seen slicks for a 24" wheel?

	I've tried a few local bike shops and got a lot of smiles, but
	no tires.  I have yet to try any of the mail order places.

	I should point out that she has no desire to ride off-road and I'm 
	looking to get her a smoother ride than the 'center rib' off-road 
	tire now provides.

	Thanks,

	-rob

    I rode the Porcupines most of last summer and have been on the Smokes
    this year--my personal preference is to the Smokes, especially on the
    front.  They've got exceptional cornering grip.  The terrain around
    here is mostly hardpack with sections of gravelly (is that a word?) 
    climbs.
    
    I would say they wear about the same.  If you ride on a lot of pavement
    to get to your off-road stuff, either one is probably only good for 500
    miles or so.  I seem to recall wearing the Porcupine nobs off the rear
    in about 300 miles, but there was a lot of asphalt helping that along.

    For the  24"  tires,  check with Cyclopedia. I buy the 20" tires I
    use from them, and I'm pretty sure they have 24" tires as well.

--David

    I'm looking for 24" slicks also.  Where is Cyclopedia ?  Is it a store
    or mail-order place ?
    
    Thanks,
    Terry

	I've searched for references to Cyclopedia and can't seem to find a 
	posting with address and a phone number...can anyone post the info
	here?  Thanks!

	-rob

    I just got back from Mt Snow NORBA Finals.  The majority of
    expert/pro's were running "Kevlar" Smokes or Porcy's.  I saw a lot of
    both.  Make sure to get Kevlar if you are interested in wheel weight. 
    They'll save your 200 + grams.  
    
    Mike

    re. -.1
    
    The various bike catalogs list component weight & price. With two
    kevlar smokes, you are only saving 100g total. Is it really worth
    the extra $20 or $30?
    
    Ed

Thanks for the info guys.  I think I might try a Smoke on the front for
cornering and a Porc on the back for traction on grades.

I checked out the Smokes & Porcs in the bike shop the other day and the only
thing that worries me about the Porcs is they appear to have very soft
sidewalls.  Anyone ever had a puncture in a Porc sidewall that caused a flat?

Robin (The Shredder)

    re -.1
    
     I tried the Smoke on the front, and found that it dug in so much
    that I tended to want to 'endo'.  I much prefer the gradual slide
    you get from a Megabyte than the "now you're holding, now you're not"
    of the smokes.  For the back, they seem to do the trick fine.
    
    mark

    In answer  to  a question a few back: Cyclopedia's phone number is
    800 678 1021.

--David

    RE: .2
    
    Don't know where you are located, but I was (finally :-) able to find 24"
    slicks at Naults in Manchester NH  (603) 669-7993
    
    Terry

    
    Hi there, 
    
     This doesn't make sense to me so I'm asking. It only makes sense that
     there would be more wear and tear on the tires if most of the riding 
     is offroad. Well last season, I switched from Farmer Johns to 
     Smokes (panaracer). It so happened that I spent more time on the road
     last season than I did on offroad. Since there is a lot hills on the 
     way home, and occasionaly I take a quick stroll on through the apple
     orchards, I used my mountain bike %50 of the time although I enjoy 
     riding my road bike more. 
     What I've realized is I got some flat spots on the tires and they 
     couldn't have had more than 600 miles on them. The Farmer John and
     cousin were still good after 1500 mls, when I switched to the smokes. 
     I must add that every time I knew I would be spending time on the road
     I would increase the pressure to 45 - 50. is this why. Is 600 miles 
     about normal life for the Smokes? I didn't think so...
     Should I be doing a lot less break and skid on the road with knobbies?
    
     Shaw

    
    	I don't think SMOKES are meant for asaphalt Shaw.
    Myself and the people I ride with carry the bikes to 
    some appropriate spot and have at it. The black wall
    SMOKES sure look good.
    
    	Roger

    
    So Roger, reading between the lines are you saying that the asphalt 
             does more damage to a tire that was designed to handle the 
             abuse of riding over rocks, gravel, mud and what have you. 
    
             What would someone like myself do, that has to ride some 
             asphalt to get to the dirt. Is there a good tire that can
             handle both? 
      
             How about the dog series from Toiga (ie, houddawg,
             maddawg ....'sp?')
    
             Yeah the Smokes look great/racy ...
    
    Shaw

    
    	I don't think there's a compromise available, is there?
    The wear is an issue of higher coefficient of friction vs.
    less contact meaning more applied force per sq in. etc. etc.
    	I guess riding there is OK but some places are kind of
    far and where do you carry the beer and the water and the
    snacks and tools and clothes and spares and where do you
    lock all that stuff up.
    	One thing that attracts me to MTB is the total absence
    of vehicular traffic. I went to a safety course in Worcester
    MA once and they had everybody sit at car consoles with brakes
    and steering tied to a computer which ran a movie. It was meant
    to train reflexes to swerve or brake or whatever appropriate
    to the circumstance on the film. When the ball rolled out in the
    street with the child after it most of us hit the brakes BUT
    about 10 people were just anxiously looking all around to see
    what all the commotion was about. That was in a class of about 50
    people.
    	Roger

    
     I just put a set of Smoke Mag's on my MTB, I could NOT pass up this
    deal...FULL bearing repack, derailleur adjustment AND Smoke Mags for 
    the all time low price $30. I didn't even wait for the stock tires to
    wear out I just put these babies on. Let me also add that the advantage 
    in the looks category of these black walled tires was worth the price..%*}
    
     I have learned over time that just 'cause some one says it's "New and
    Improved" dosen't mean it's allways so, as a result I didn't expect to
    "Notice" much by way of diffrence. Well I was very wrong! The first
    thing I noticed was that you could "Feel" these tires, and as you rolled on
    pavement, they also produced a noticable rolling resistance and a nice 
    growl as you get them up to speed. But since I very rarely ride the ATB
    on the road this is no problem to me.
    
     Off road is where these tires show their real spirit. The first thing I
    noticed was a smoothness to the ride, rocks that would normally
    slide out from under the tires, stay put, small stones and sticks were
    just conformed to by the tires with a resulting smoothness. Leaves on 
    rocks, and these were wet leaves, proved to be no problem, there was NO
    noticable slippage. Because it was rather cold yesterday I stayed away 
    from mud as much as I could, but in the few instances it was unavoidable, 
    the tires cleared themselves completly and offered all the traction I 
    needed. Climbing fallen logs was fun as both tires did what was expected 
    with none of the surprises the old panaracers offered me.
    
     I feel that the softness of the rubber and the tread design combine to
    make these tires well worth the investment. As for the durability
    question, time will answer that for me. But for a 1 ride only review, I
    would not hesitate in buying another pair, should this price be offered
    again.
    
     Regs,
     Paul
    
     PS: I ride a Sterling ATB, Cro-Mo frame, elevated chainstay, Shimano 300
         WITH Smoke Magnum Black walled tires...  

    
    Hey Paul, was this just a one time deal? Is there more? 
    I have been living with the flat spots on my tires for a while now.
    I know my next set will be the Smokes.  Where did you buy them
    from. 
    As much as I would like to support my local bike shop, I am very
    disatisfied with the wheel throughing that they did on my last
    tune up!
    
    Shaw

    Shaw,
    
     This was really a one time deal 'cause I have brought Dave a bit of
    business. Dave Rivetts is the owner of Free Motion Cyclery in 
    Hubbardston. He very often has SUPER deals on bikes and bike stuff.
    Drop him a line, you can reach him on WMOIS::RIVETTS_D, and see what he
    can do for you. He has treated me more than fair over the last several
    years, and the deals just keep getting better. His original asking
    prices for a pair of Smoke Mag's was 1/2 of what Mt. Snow wanted. I
    know we're talk extremes here, but you just can't beat this guy for a
    small shop.
    
    PM

    It'd be nice to hear what tires you upgraded from.

    Matt,
    
     Off hand I don't remember what model they are, but they're Panaracers
    with a fairly agressive tread design though not nearly as wide as the
    2.2 Mags. They're also a firmer compound.
    
     If I remember, I'll look at the old ones for the width and model and
    post it here.
    
     That is "IF" I'm still here...Monday is "BLACK MONDAY" here at WMO,
    I'll be looking over my shoulder all morning. 
    
    PM

    Matt,
    
     I looked over at my old tires and boy was I ever wrong...there not
    Panaracers at all, those are on my wifes bike, but there Cheng Sheng's
    at a 1.9 inch width and a very firm compound.
    
    PM

My Marin Pine Mountain came w/ Cheng Sheng's.  MBA said that they were good
tires.  Compared to the 2 year old Ritchey Mod-Quads they were not.  After
several months of hard riding the gum wall seperated from the tred.  The front
tire was replace under warentee w/ Ritchey Megabyte Hard Drive.  It seems
to be smoother and grip better on the trails I ride on (Colorado and Moab).
The rear tire is starting to seperate too.  I might have it replaced, and
will not choose Cheng Sheng's

mark (hammer the knarly single track ;-)) lyon

    
    Do any of you MTBers have the Toiga Psycho tires? I am buying new
    tires today and am comparing between Smoke/dart combo and the 
    Psycho. I am kinda inclined towards the psychos although they cost
    slightly more. They are a little bit lighter than the smoke/dart.
    I ride in the east. Aside from the mud, most of the terrain I ride
    varries from hard pack to rocks and loose gravel. 
    
    Shaw

My son has ~80 miles of riding on his Psychos and is
very happy with them so far.  He rides the terrain you
describe in N.H.  They came on his new bike, so he really
hasn't anything to compare them to apples-to-apples (his old
ride was shod with Smoke clones and was a slack geometry
w/long chainstays to boot).  They certainly seem to hook-up
well on steep, loamy single-track climbs in the woods.  And
as he passed me @40mph + yesterday on a long turning descent,
the lean he was achieving convinces me they stick on pavement
as well!

So...what did you buy?

Greg

    
    Thanks for the reply Greg, sounds like they would be good climbers 
    which is most important to me. I went out at lunch time and got
    the psychos. Major problem is, my front wheel need trueing. The shop
    is so busy that I am not getting my bike back till Tues. May 4th. 
    This is not good, since I am going up to the white mountains this
    weekend and I realy don't care that much for riding rentals. 
    
    Happy trails, 
    
    Shaw