Conference noted::bicycle

    
       Chris,
    
       I'm just buying a mountain bike myself.  I've been looking and
    comparing and asking questions.  I originally wanted a Specialized
    Hardrock myself but as I learned more about what you get for that
    price range I had to adjust aver upward to accomadate my needs.
    
       I own a Specialized Allez road bike that I have been racing on
    for 4 years and love it.  As a result I would like to stay with
    specialized for a mountain bike as well.
    
       The reasons I am not going to buy a Hardrock are all component
    related.  
     
           1. The bars are curved instead of flat and the stem was not
              quite as good as a higher level bike. (I plan on abusing
              this bike out in the woods and anywhere else I can go
    	      so strength is a big consideration).
    
    	   2. The rims were not nearly as strong as what you will get
              with a higher priced bike (again think abuse !)
    
    	   3. The Rockhopper Sport (one step above Rockhopper, one step
    	      below Rockhopper Comp) comes with toe clips and round
    	      chain rings. both a must for me.
    
    	   4. Durability of Drivetrain Components goes up as you step
    	      up to the higher end of the line.
    
    	   5. I like the paint job better on the Rockhoppers.
    
     its so completely different from buying a road bike.  My only real
     concern here is Durability.  I can't wait to start puting the new
     bike through its paces in the state forest and power lines near
     my parents house !!
    
     John C.
    

    RE:1
    
    Hi John,
     Yesterday after work I went out and hit the open trails with my
    Hardrock. I put the thing through some pretty rough terrain at some
    very high speeds and she held up pretty well. I am also concerned
    about durability in the long run, and I too question the rims that
    come stock on this bike. It seems that every time I purchase a new
    bike, I go right out and start upgrading it from top to bottom even
    though I tell myself that I won't do this before I buy it! I think
    now that for the extra $75.00, I should have gotten the Hardrock
    Sport. I say this because I have already put about $50.00 into my
    Hardrock since I got it last week. You mentioned the fact that you
    prefer the straight bars rather than the stock ones that come with
    the Hardrock, and I will agree with that.(next on my list)
    
       Oh well, I'll just have to make due for now. Maybe if I decide
    to get serious about Mt.bike riding, the next bike will be more
    of what I want up front. Thanks for your input again!
    
    "Happy Trails"
    
    Chris

  I'd like to express a different view on an opinion that I've read several
  times in this conference.  That opinion is to buy a bike with cheaper
  components and then upgrade a bit at a time, after all the frame is what's
  really important.

  No argument about the frame, it is important, but otherwise my opinion is
  just the opposite, that is save your money and buy the best bike you can
  and then DOWNGRADE as things wear out/break.  The price of components on a
  complete bike or even purchased as a group is much cheaper than buying them
  one at a time and then what do you do with the old components throw them
  out, sell them?

  I bought my road bike 3 years ago and I went with the best stuff (IMO of
  course) Dura-Ace, Mavic etc.  As thing have broken or worn out I've made
  the decision to replace them with Dura-Ace or something cheaper:

      - I tore the front derailluer hanger off so I replaced it with a clamp-on 
        model.  Dura-Ace about $50, an old Shimano 600 about $15.  600 was the
        easy choice.

      - Chain - Dura-Ace chain for about $35, no way!

      - Bottom bracket - OK, I paid for the Dura-Ace.

      - In my latest crash this past weekend I broke the brake lever off.  
        $90 for Dura-Ace ($129 for Campy Record!), no thanks the Ultegra will
        do just fine.

      - I just switched from a 42 to a 39 tooth inner chain ring.  SR had
        one for $14.  Of course there was always Dura-Ace for $39 or Campy
        for $55.

      - New wheels, of course I want the good rims, but if I can save $75 by
        going with Ultegra hubs that sounds like a good choice.

      - Actually I do upgrade sometimes.  When I broke the levers I also bent
        the bars.  So it's time to quit talking about the Modolo bars and go
        and get them, so I did last night.  BTW they will work with a Cinelli
        1R stem but you have to saw the bolt back a little.  The shop did this
        for me no charge.

    Sounds like a really good frame.  With everything else getting
    destroyed and the frame still usable, that is.  :-)
    
    ed

    
    	Sounds like you could sum it up by saying ....
    
    	"No Matter What End You Start At, High or Low, 
    	 We are all going to end up somewhere in 
    	 the middle" ;-)
    
    					_Jerry
    
    	BTW - The folks in the Bicycle Industry regard this
    	      phenomonema (sp?) as "taking it in the end"
    	      or Shorts as they say in N.E. :-) 

    
    
    Hi there,
    
    I'm going to buy a mountain bike (low range) soon... I don't
    plan on going on the most difficult and bumpy trails, just
    your ordinary off-road treks.  I was thinking about either
    the Hardrock or the Trek 820 ($329 and $319 respectively)
    and would like opinions on what is the better choice.
    They look about the same to me, and you get a free helmet
    with the Hardrock now.
    
    What d'ya think?
    
    

    The Hardrock is a good buy, though it doesn't have the durability for
    cross country (off-trail) use.  The Trek is probably good too, but if
    you need the helmet, go for the Hardrock.
    
    Ken
    

    
    
    So.... does that mean that the Trek 820 is also not durable enough
    for off-trail?  Can I only ride on dirt roads or something? 
    I guess I'd rather go for the sturdier of the two, if there is one.
    (BTW, all Specialized mountain bikes at the Hardrock level and above
    are coming with a free helmet these days)
    
    

    The local mountain bike shops here in Colorado Springs who sell
    Specialized bikes use the HARDROCK as their rentals.  I don't see
    why they wouldn't be alright for trails.  I've used a KHS Montana
    which approximately the same bike for the past 4 years and all I
    ride is trails!

    Locally, one of the backpacking stores has started selling mountain
    bikes.  They have BRIDGESTONE (don't laugh) with CROMOLY frames,
    Shimino components with Mountain 300 LX deraillers - Price is a
    mere $269.  I've known several beginners to get this bike.  Compare
    it to the Hardrock if you can find it locally.  You will find they
    have the same components.
    

Hi,

   In regards to your Hardrock question, I have a Hardrock Sport that I bought 
last year.  So far no problems.  I take it off road pretty often but not
what you'd call hardcore stuff.  I also carry my son who weighs ~40 lbs quite
often (he loves it).  I weigh 225 so every time I get on the bike it's being
abused to a large degree :-) .  I especially like the tamer tires that come
with the Hardrock Sport over the knobbier Rockhopper tires since about 75%
of my time is spent cruising around town.

   The Hardrock Sport has the Suntour components which I personally like
because I can skip gears when shifting down.  I keep the air pressure up
in the 50 psi range to help protect my rims and that still gives me a fairly
cushy ride with me and my boy both on it.  

   I shopped a lot and also narrowed it down to the Specialized and the Trek.
I liked the looks of the Specialized and the dealer and disliked the Trek
dealer so I made my final choice based on the dealer primarily.  I imagine
either one would be fine for most riders.

Good luck and have 'em knock off $30.00 or so like I did :-),
Mike.

fwiw - In the under $500 price range, I have been recommending folks take a
serious look at the Bridgestone MB-5.  This bike was rated a 'best-buy' in
a recent issue of _Bicycling_ magazine at $499 list.  A local CO Springs shop 
had this one on sale recently for $419.  Good frame materials and construction
as well as a very nice component mix.  

You probably can't go wrong with a Specialized MTB either, though my impression 
is that they tend to cost a little more than average.  I am not sure if this
is still true, but Specialized frames were the same as Giant.  (Made in same 
factory with same materials)  Last I noticed, the Giant bikes were a little
less expensive (though they may use a different components).
	Greg