Conference terri::cars_uk

    
    	As far as Im aware they are well maintained ie anything they
    	need they get, after all were not talking PHH or HERTZ leasing
    	here paying the bills (measuring tread depth with a micrometer,) 
    	Its tax payers money that maintains these motors!!!
     
    	The only other thing I can remember about them is it could be
    	difficult to get an age on the vehicle as the MOD dont register
    	them with the DVLC.
    
    	I once was thinking about buying one of these motors I looked at 
    	some and the looked ok, I ended up with a suzy jeep Its the wife 
    	who drives it, she thought a cammo lightweight landrover was to
    	macho for her (I prefered  the LANDY)
    
    	As for the electrics I think some are 24v. a reputable Exwd dealer
    	should convert it  before you get it, the dealer I talked to also
    	gave em a service and a limited warranty.
    
    	I heard some stats about landrovers and they reckoned out of all 
    	landrovers ever built, about 75% are still on the road.
    	(apart from the ones hit by bazooker fire or number 9 buses)
    
    
    	Good luck if you get one, it will probably still be going
    	when my suzy is recycled into dustbins.
    	also make sure youve a big fat wallet to keep it tanked up
    	they drink petrol like us yorkies drink tetley bitter
    
    	Ken
    
    	P.s go on tell us why you want one 

    What I remember from when I was in the mob is that they were well
    maintained but thrashed without mercy. I'm not sure if the engines were
    modified for the forces to run on sump drainings, but they were
    generally gutless and drank petrol at 12MPG in normal circumstances on
    the road, although some virtuoso driving from our gunners got even
    worse figures than that!
    
    The thrashing also applies to the chassis - they get rolled, jammed on
    rocks, stalled in rivers etc...etc... So look very carefully at what is
    on offer, if it's not a 'steal' then its probably too expensive.
    
    - John.

    
    
    	My experience of MOD vehicles is limited to the "non combat" type,
    	IE. cars, vans etc. they are all VERY well maintained, additionally 
    	only selected and approved personnel may drive them. 
    	They are obviously not bashed around as much as the ones which the 
    	squaddies get their hands on!
    
    	Graham.

    
    re .2
    
    I dont think anyone buying a ex MOD company car should expect
    to drive away a Rolls Royce AL-a ex commercial company cars
    
    you dont know where theve been or what they've done
    
    But from what I gather bits get changed on em before they go
    wrong sort of on a P.M basis and the oil gets changed on a 
    regular basis and if they bend a chassis they change it!
    
    They are worked hard but they are built to withstand it
    I would think the MOD demand a higher standard of build
    quality than normal Landrovers like they specify military
    specs on electronic equipment. 
    
    At least they are genuine one previous owner. you could
    term them like a woman of the night "used by lots of squaddies
    and still going strong" 
    
    K 

    
    
    When I was at school we had a Combined Cadet Force playing tin pot
    soldiers etc
    
    I was fortunate enough to be seconded to the Royal Electrical and
    Mechanical Engineers in Germany for two weeks repairing LandRovers !!
    
    They get thrashed and thrashed but also get all their maintenance
    done to the text book. 
    
    I would look underneath to see how dented !!!! I'd buy a blue one
    before a green one. Blue ones are ex RAF, Navy or Military Police and
    likely to be a better bet.  
    
    You'll get an age related plate if you can prove its age when you have 
    to register it, otherwise it'll be Q'd.
    
    See You 
    		Chris.

    re .1 ....
    
    OK, you asked, I'll bite....
    
    I've been wrestling with the problem of the "next" vehicle since my
    Savanna was written off by some dork that didn't know where the brake
    (or was it break?) pedal was. The Savanna was Ok as far as it went in
    that whilst it would accomodate all the family and would just about
    pull our 'van performance whilst doing was about sick parrot level and
    fuel consumption even worse. 
    
    I decided that what I wanted was either a Citroen XM dieso turble
    estate (until the telephone number price from PHH scotched that) or a
    Discovery (until confirmation from owners that fuyel consumption really
    **IS** is gold card league and I wasn't about to start subsidising
    Digital when clocking up the business miles). Anyway we went back to
    the drawing board and were experiencing the ususl speedy 3-4 week
    turnaround time from PHH/Hertz on quotes: I was even prepared to take
    the Income Tax hit on vehicles >2.0l on the off chance (I must be a
    borne optimist!) that the revised banding scheme would soften the blow
    a little. Then the Order of the Brown Envelope arrived and sort of put
    everything into perspective.
    
    Well, I don't have to worry about Car Tax anymore (I won't go back to
    being a company car driver unless unavoidable) and one of the options
    is something that will a) tug the van with no problems, b) house the
    family and all the junk that they like to take on hols, c) be
    affordable within the slight flexibility that the redundancy cheque
    will give and within reasonable bounds (i.e. limited mileage) give me a
    set of wheels without cramping Lynn'e need for continuous access to her
    car as the family chauffeur/taxi driver.
    
    So, there you have it........
    
    Anyway, I'd still like to browse a few LROC Mags or other publications
    if anybody can spare them for a few days. If anybody knows of sales
    outlets that specialise in this sort of thing that information also
    gratefully received. The only place that I know of is that humungeous
    place on the main road towards Derby. Anybody know what it's called?
     
    
    

    There is a garage near me that specialises in selling and repairing
    Landrovers. 
    
    Give me a call and I'll tell you his details.
    
    Simon
    830-3122

    Dick,
    
    	sorry to hear about the brown envelope. re. Landrovers though, i
    was reading an article in a car mag while loitering in W H Smiths and
    the subject was buying ex MOD landrovers from the specialist auctions. 
    
    I think it was CAR mag but can't be certain. It was about 3/4 weeks ago so 
    may still be on the shelves. The journalist ended up paying 500 - 600 quid
    for a pretty battered looking item. The conclusion seemed to be that
    that was the place to get the best deals, but keep your wits about you
    viz the sort of dealers you are up against. It also presupposes that
    you are fairly diy-competent to fix it up or else get it fixed.
    
    cheers
    chris 
         

>    What I remember from when I was in the mob is that they were well
>    maintained but thrashed without mercy. I'm not sure if the engines were
>    modified for the forces to run on sump drainings, but they were
>    generally gutless and drank petrol at 12MPG in normal circumstances on
>    the road, although some virtuoso driving from our gunners got even
>    worse figures than that!
    
The low performance would be due to being tuned for and using very low
octane fuel (about 87-ish I think).  This is done on the basis that it is
available worldwide.  The 93+ octane fuel used in most of western Europe is
not universally available.  My experience is that there vehicles run like 
rockets if filled with normal 4*.

jb

    Dick,
    
    Having owned ex-MoD Land Rovers in the past there are a number of 
    things to look for.
    
    Military models are the most basic you can buy!  They lack all the 
    creature comforts of civvy models.  They have a hard life but are 
    generally well maintained.  Original engines still have their coat of 
    Solihull grey paint but Army recon units are painted green.
    
    Remember that the Army has a casting system.  Most Land Rovers are 
    disposed of because they are worn out!  They have problems that are 
    deemed to be uneconomical to fix and they are sold through auction.
    
    Most Ex-Army models will be Nato green (a lovely shade of matt olive) 
    or camoflauge (matt green and black).  There are variations in the 
    build standard depending of the original usage.  
    
    Starting with the Series 3 models (up to about 1983) there tend to be 
    two varaints:  the short wheelbase `lightweight' and the long 
    wheelbase.  The Army bought very few standard short wheelbase series 3.  
    Most lightweights, or air portables to give them their correct name, 
    are FFR (fitted for radio) and have 24 volt electrics with screened 
    ignition systems.  They can be converted but you have to replace 
    *everything*.  The two huge batteries are located between the front 
    seats and the alternator has a high output that requires two drive 
    belts.
    
    The series 3 long wheelbase again are mainly FFR although there are 
    some varaitions.  I had an ex Military Police one that was almost a 
    civvy spec.
    
    Most ex-Army L-Rs have twin fuel tanks under the front seats and you 
    have to lift the seat to get to the high capacity filler caps.  The 
    rear cross-member is also a different pattern and will normally have a 
    NATO pintle hook for towing.  This will require an adaptor plate to 
    take a normal 50mm towball.  The electric socket for the trailer is a 
    12 pin job and the lighting circuits allow for convoy lights and is a 
    b*st%*d to fault find!
    
    The later coil sprung 90 and 110 models are just starting to find their 
    way onto the market.  A lot of these are diesel (non-turbo).
    
    The most serious problem I have encountered is chassis rot.  They are 
    regularly used in harsh conditions and although they are pressure 
    washed before leaving the training grounds the chassis fills up with 
    mud.  When I replaced an outrigger on my 109 there was about two inches 
    of sand in the chassis.  Instant fix and sell job!  Having said that 
    the engine has done a creditable 153,000 miles when I sold it.  It did 
    about 100 miles to a pint of oil and always did 18mpg regardless - 
    solo, towing, loaded or empty!  The original spec Goodyear extra-grip 
    tyres are noisey and wear out quickly on the road but are excellent 
    cross country and *very* expensive.
    
    They are reasonably cheap but you want to watch what you buy!  There are 
    dealers who specialise in ex-MoD Land Rovers - Keith Gott at Bordon and 
    PRB at Leeds - but buying direct from the auction can mean having to 
    buy a lot of four and then you have to register them!  There is a bit 
    of a cartel in the dealers who go so as well.
    
    Bon chance in your hunt.  If you want to talk some more... Land Rovers 
    are one of my favourite subjects!
    
    Alan
    

    I have seen some very nice and clean ex-WD lightweights. The 24v
    alternator costs about �800 to replace.
    
    Have a word with David Findlay on 0734 745010. He specialises in
    'landys.
    
    Simon

    Re magazines
    
    I'll try to look out an AWDC club mag or two.
    
    Keith Gott certainly deals in ex-WD vehicles.  I think he usually
    has an advert in the club mag, so you could contact him (in Bordon).
    
    Re CAR magazine
    
    There was an article where one of the CAR staff - I forget who - went
    to an auction and bought a rough ex-Army Land Rover.  I don't think it
    gave much in the way of useful information, other than a very serious
    warning to look over what you are about to purchase and to take off
    the rose-tinted spectacles beforehand...  I don't usually keep old
    copies of this magazine, so I doubt I still have it at home.
    
    J.R.
    
    PS If you buy a Landy, do consider joining the LROC and/or AWDC.

    From and advert in 'International Off Roader' :-
    
    	EX-WD LAND ROVERS
    
    	...
    
    	Basic running/driving models to deluxe models built to your
    	specification.  THE PRICE DEPENDS ON YOU.  All are undersealed
    	from new, have twin fuel tanks, oil coolers and H/D suspension
    	amongst their many extras.  SWB, LWB, LT/WT, ambulances, petrol
    	and diesel, civvy models also available.
    	Price Guide: LWB ex-WD with on year's MOT, new reg, 6 months
    	road tax, From �2,500 + �375 VAT.
    
    	...
    
    	Telephone KEITH GOTT on (0420) 473818
    
    	'Tail Gates', Hogmoor Road, Bordon, Hants GU35 9HL
    
    
    I have no connection with this person, other than knowing the name.
    Probably well worth a chat, as he is definitely a Land Rover 'expert'.
    
    J.R.