Conference terri::cars_uk

    
    Keith (or anyone).
    
    Do you know what they base their 'best of' on? Is it simply the
    collected opinion of their journalists? Do they take into account
    the opinions of 'real' owners? What _did_ win best sportscar? :^)
    
    Mark

    � Best Value Car - Ford Fiesta 1.1L
    
    I have just driven 165 miles from Woodbridge to Newbury in one of
    these (hire care, the envy marks are being taken off the Range Rover),
    and I'm considering leaving it here on Friday and walking back as a
    preferable alternative to driving it that distance again. My back
    hurts from the crappy seat, my legs are stiff from the lack of room
    for anyone greater than 5 feet tall, and my ears are ringing from the
    varied selection of rattles and hums that the revolting little object
    emits at anything greater than 15 mph, not to mention the apalling
    road and wind noise at speed. It has no accelaration, you have to
    keep the throttle floored just to manage a constant 70, and it doesn't
    like driving in straight lines. I hate it, and wouldn't recommend that
    anyone buy one if they plan to ever do more than a 5 mile trip in it.
    
    JJ.

    
    Oh come on JJ, tell us what you _really_ think! :^)
    
    Mark
    
    PS A Fiesta would have to be _very_ good to overcome the memories of
    my wife's 1300 Ghia Mk1!

    My Girlfriend has a Fiesta 1.1 Pop Plus, and she loves it. I'm not too
    impressed, and have looked into running costs like new price &
    depreciation etc. It looks like the Clio 1.2 base model is cheaper,
    more economical, better performing, greener (If you think a cat is
    better than no cat), and loses 1000 pounds less over three years.
    
    I'm not sure how Ford justify selling cars so grossly bad.
    
    Mark.

    Well I gave the Fiesta back on Saturday, but as the Range Rover
    decided to mash a wheel bearing this morning had to hire another
    car, this time a Renault Clio. I'm impressed. Smoother, quieter,
    faster, more comfortable, and a lot more substantial feeling than
    the Fiesta. Even the little 1.2 which I've got seems quite sporty,
    and I didn't have anything like the feeling of fatigue after
    driving 160 miles like I did with the horrible Fiesta. Imho the
    Clio is a nice little car.
    
    JJ.

    Re .7
    
    After all those compliments, the damn thing's blown a drive shaft
    (at 3000 miles old)... next!
    
    JJ.

    re . 7 
    I had a clio 1.2 on hire once, and I must agree with you ...Its a great
    little car.
    
    
                        KR
    
    

    But how can you drive something called a clio? It sounds like civilised
    phleghm.
    
    Dougie
    
    (who drives a car that sounds like a dirrrrrrty magazine!)
    

>>    Dougie
>>    
>>    (who drives a car that sounds like a dirrrrrrty magazine!)
    
    Mini Mayfair perhaps ?
    
    
    Shaun.

    Ford Gardeners Weekly ?
    
    Fiesta!

    
    Astra CLUB perhaps?????
    
    
    	Andy....I-hope-it's-not-another-Ford....
    

    
    Seems like a waste of time to me. Not one Ford amongst the
    lot of them. Why is that do you suppose ? Surely Fords aren't
    that bad. This is for 1992 I presume.?
    
    Also, whats happened to the Alfa Romeo 164 Tspark in the executive
    catagory ? Last year it was voted executive car of the year and if
    I remember correctly by the same magazine.
    
    If you've only written in the top five in each group then it may be
    of interest to see the tail enders for each one.
    
    JN.

    
    Interesting - the number of Fords on the road, and they didn't feature
    once in that list. Makes me wonder weather it was the list favoured by a 
    fat and bored editorial team or by the vehicle buying public.
    
    Or maybe rut the nut wrote it (snigger).
    
    -Tony

    
    Re .17
    
    Tony, check out fleet car buyers top 10 for Ford-amania! :^)
    
    Mark

    8^)

    

    What a poxy magazine. Last year the Rover Metro was their car of
    the year. It's still around but is now beaten by the AX, a car that's
    been around for years.
    
    Yawn.

    
    Keef, if it would make you feel better you could spell check my notes 
    before I enter them. You have my full permission.
    
    Well, as stated previously, its a crap magazine anyway if its their
    opinion and not the real truth (ie what the public likes). What do these 
    polls mean if its just the opinion of a few people who probably take
    the tube or cycle to work? Nothing.
    
    -Tony

    
    Don't get me wrong but I wouldn't expect any Ford to win
    in *any* of the groups but I would expect them to have
    some sort of showing somewhere.
    
    I don't like modern Fords and they made a huge mistake with
    the new Escort which has a shape about as pleasing as a kick
    in the nuts AND Ford kept the same engine. The same goes for
    the Orion. The 1.4 LX Escorts had to be recalled as they handled
    like a whale on a skateboard because Ford neglected to fit an anti
    roll bar at the front.
    
    Maybe Fords' fortunes will return now that they have the new Zeta
    engine which has been long awaited. The old CVH unit didn't like
    anything above 4000 Rpm.
    
    Thinking about it, I see alot of new cars on the road and the majority
    of them are not Fords. There are alot of Fords on the road though as they
    make a viable second hand purchase.
    
    My uncle used to work for Ford but he still knocks about with the
    blokes he worked with and the saying that they don't build them 
    like they used to is true. They only build 60,000 'fleet' miles
    into them and after that they start to fall apart.
    
    JN.
    

The family cars seemed a bit strange, they are all too small. 

/Dave.

    Good point Dave. For me, with three children, our current Granada
    Estate is the minimum size I could consider. I'm looking to replace it,
    and am looking at Audi 100, BMW 5-series, Granada size vehicles, all
    estates. In my view, those quoted would be too small even for a family
    of four.
    
    Laurie.

    
    More a young couple with a couple (at most) of nippers car (Probably
    decided that was too long a title! :^)).
    
    Of course, any responsible family wouldn't consist of more than 4
    people (oh and the dog!).
    
    Mark

	My brother's just bought himself a Mercedes estate (2 litre
	petrol) to haul his kids around in; full history, one-owner,
	1983, �2�k. Good value I'd say, and certainly big enough...

	JJ.

RE:        <<< Note 1723.26 by NEWOA::SAXBY "Clever critters;Squirrels!" >>>

�    Of course, any responsible family wouldn't consist of more than 4
�    people (oh and the dog!).
    
    Ah Mark, the thing is, some of us have a duty to do what we can to
    enrichen and improve the quality of the national gene pool.
    
    Laurie.

    
    I feel that the car mags are too critical when it comes to
    testing cars. Theres too much detail involved which only
    confuses the person trying to choose what to buy whether
    it be a new or second hand car.
    
    They pick up on the differences that Mr Joe Punter would not
    notice or even think of looking for. Anything obvious will
    present itself anyway.
    
    At the end of the day if, for example, you wish to nake a choice
    between an Escort and an Astra you go and test drive them and make
    your own mind up.
    
    JN.
    

    
    Bull.

    
    Gosh..!!
    
    
    Hear Hear..!!!!!!!!
    
    
    Usual Scenario:
    
    Top Gear/Any Auto Mag = Anybody who gets _PAID_ to give His/Her
    _PERSONAL_ opinion (Because that's what it is..!!) = I can rubbish the
    latest Aston/Ferrari/Porsche.....and use silly words that nobody _EVER_
    uses...
    
    _BUT_ my company car is a Vauxhall/Ford L..but who cares suckers 'cos I
    earn loads of wad..get to drive all the latest/best motors...and I read
    from a script anyway....!!!!
    
    They are _NOT_ experts.....

    
    Re .33
    
    Can be applied to any form of employment, except pure production work.
    
    Mark
    

    
    I'm not a Ford fanatic believe it or not. Yeah, I drive a Ford out of
    chance (it happened to fit my requirements) but I'm only sticking up
    for them coz they're decent enough motors and are getting a real
    slapping in here. I was admiring a Renalt Clio 16v recently, and after
    commenting that it looked very nice, the owner turned round to me and 
    said "Yeah, it is nice, but your Ford is shit" - thats the attitude that 
    gets my back up.
    
    Thats my 2p's worth.
    -Tony

> coz they're decent enough motors

That's probably the crux of the whole argument. I was unfortunate to
have an Escort 1.6i Ghia for a hire car last week. It was the worst car
I have ever driven, the gearbox was sloppy, with a lot of travel, the
power steering was hopelessly light, and the suspension had more rock n
roll than Elvis. The engine was noisy and for a 1.6 injection, had very
poor performance. 

On the good side the ICE was excellent.

But someone must like them..

IMHO, of course.


Greg

    
    Then why did you bother to hire one ? Most hire companies will
    exchange a car if you are unhappy with it. Why didn't you swop 
    it for a better car ?

> Then why did you bother to hire one

'cos my lease mobile was in for repair, and it was what turned up at 5.30pm

> Why didn't you swop 
>   it for a better car ?

Because I was out of the office, doing my job, until mine was available again.

    
    :^)
    
    Mark

                    <<< Note 1723.40 by PAKORA::KCORMACK >>>
                               -< Clio clientel >-

     In the Clio ads have you noticed  the only people interested in a Clio 
    are a slut, a dirty auld man who is giving someone elses wife one and a 
    hard up biker who can't afford a 16v Clio. Hardly a good image for a
    manufacturer to create for their new 16valve pocket rocket ?
 
What?! 

Are you and I watching the same advert? Mere conjecture, m'lord. 

dougie
    
    
    

I'd like to nominate car adverts I like (coz they're nice!), and car
adverts I don't (way off base topic!)

Clio Adverts (I like Nicole!)
19 16V Adverts
Rover advert with the guy putting his baby to sleep in it.
Citroen AX advert with lots of cupids.
Mercedes advert with the guy steering it all over the place.

Ones I hate:

BMW Ultimate Driving Machine nonsense.
  - pretending their green coz some of the car can be recycled.
    (absolutely amazing claim!)
  - talking about some wonderful rear axle, as if it is the only
    way not to take the direct route down a mountain. Funny, I
    don't think my car has one of these, but it manages pretty well.

Anyway, my point is, no matter how nice BMW's are, I dislike them
because of the adverts.

Mark

    On the subject of TV adverts (wrong topic, I know) -
    
    	The Primera has a certain interest...
    
    J.R.

    I found it funny seeing that near the end of the Clio 16v ad, the car
    goes driving past a spluttering brand-spanking new bike... looks like
    a Ducati (anyone know for sure)...
    
    How anyone could prefer a Clio to any decent bike is far beyond my
    understanding unless of course they have families... maybe that's were
    they were going! ;-)

    Re: .45....I thought it was funny..!!
    :-) :-)
    
    re: .46...interesting point..The young guy roars off in the Clio, and
    later meets the bike spluttering along...
    Questions:
    A) Is the Clio so slow that it can't catch this spluttering monster..?
    or:
    B) Has the bike zoomed off, the bloke had his nookie, is on the way
    back and had some problems..??
    
    answers on a postcard etc etc etc....
    
    :-) :-) :-)
    

    
    I've no idea what you lot are on about but it sounds like an
    interesting advert.
    
    The only Clio ad. that I've seen is when a vagrant comes out of a diner
    in the middle of nowhere and is about to light a cigarette with his
    last match. In the distance, miles and miles away there is a Clio fast
    approaching. A load of shots of Clio approaching and match burning.
    Then as the Clio speeds by the match is blown out. At this point I
    expect to hear the music from the cigar adverts none of which I've seen
    for ages and can't even remeber the brand of cigar. Out of interest,
    does anybody know the cigar or the title of this bit of music?
    
    This Clio ad. is the most boring advert I've ever seen.
    
    Chris
    

    
    Re .48
    
    Probably Hamlet, but Cigar ads were recently barred from British TV,
    so we don't get 'em anymore.
    
    Mark

    
    	Wrong place to ask you're question, but as were here....
    
    
    HAMLETT cigars,    Air on a G-string     (I think)

    
    What do you mean the wrong place to ask?
    
    In best noting tradition this note went way off line as early as note 5.
    
    Then in note 7 that we got onto the Clio, followed by a discussion of
    what do car magazine drivers know anyway, then around note 40 we started
    on Clio adverts. I merely followed through with adverts in general. I
    believe it's called evolution. There is the cue to start talking about
    Mercedes.
    
    Chris
    

    re: .50
    
    > Air on a G-string 
    
    Right (that is the 'popular title'), the full title is:
    
    Bach J S - Aria in Suite No: 3 in D.
    
    Mike H.
    

    
    Thanks all, for the answers.
    
    By the way I don't like What Car. The only car mag I regularly buy is
    CCC, best magazine around.
    
    Chris
    

    This morning, I spied a 'Jam Sandwich' some way ahead of me in traffic,
    but couldn't tell quite what vehicle it was. Initially, I thought that
    it was possibly a Primera, but when I later caught and passed it, I
    found out that it was a Mondeo...
    
    I guess these are given away by Ford to the Police force, in order
    to get additional high-mileage testing performed on the vehicle ?
    
    J.R.

    RE:
    
    �Better looking than a Sierra and a Micra !!
    
    So is dog turds... but hey if you wanna drive them!
    
    Bob

    Quotes from Autocar (W/o perm)
    
    "Style, fine build and finish, high standard of interior appointment
    and design, zestful performance and terrific chassis, there's nothing
    to touch it for the money"
    
    "Where it runs the BMW (316i) close it comes very close and where it
    beats it - as a complete and capable all-rounder - it does so with
    daylight to spare"
    
    "It is the best car in its class - by a mile"
    
    "We never thought we'd write that about a Ford, but we're glad that
    we've had the opportunity.  We mean it:  the MONDEO is a revelation"
    
    

    re: .55
    
    You saw a JS up the line from you and couldn't rest until you'd pulled
    out, hared up the outside and roared by, blowing the horn and making
    gestures, right?
    
    Wish I had your attitude! 8*) 8*) 8*)
    
    Richard
    

�    You saw a JS up the line from you and couldn't rest until you'd pulled
�    out, hared up the outside and roared by, blowing the horn and making
�    gestures, right?
    
    Yeah, just fancied a gamble !!!   ;-)
    
    [bad] quote: "Now, ask yourself 'Do I feel lucky today?'"
    
    Actually, he stopped outside a paper shop along the road, so I
    got to pass him at a sedate pace.  :-)
    
    J.R.

I just saw a mondeo on the road for the first time. I dont know what the 
fuss is all about!! IMHO, lots have been on the road for over a year. Its 
called....... 


MAZDA 626!!

									
Have a good look at the front (slit-eyed?) and back of a 626 then 
compare.

FWIW Ford owns about 20% of Mazda and Mazda does an awful lot of design 
work for FORD USA.

Eddie (who-has-been-away-for-awhile)

> I just saw a mondeo on the road for the first time. I dont know what the 

Yeah, so did I this morning....got stuck behind it...it was being driven in
true Ford snail fashion !

    
    I saw a Mondeo on release day, complete with trade plates. I sort of
    guessed it was being delivered seeing as the car behind it was a
    Jackson's courtesy car.
    
    Pity help the new owner as the guy delivering it decided he'd try and
    keep up with me round the ring road!!!!!! (he had no chance!!!!).
    
    POL   :-)
    

    Silly B&%#@r in a Jumbo Jet tried to keep up with me the other day...
    I lost  him though at the end of the runway.
    
    Held my nerve right to the last even with all these car lights coming
    toward me.
    
    

    Re .62
    
    In the Philippines you see all these Mazda 626 hatchbacks bombing
    around but when you look closely they're Fords. Can't remember the model
    name off hand. I believe there used to be both Ford and Mazda assembly
    plants in the Philippines and they consolidated their effort and
    rebadged the Mazdas. So there most definitely is a link.
    
    Richard

    
    
    Ford own 25% of Mazda and have carved up some markets so they don't
    compete against each other. Ford sells Mazdas badged as Fords and
    vice versa.
    
    Recent plans for further joint development though have been scrapped.
    Ford has done an MPV deal with VW and a 'jeep' deal with Nissan.
    
    Richard.