Conference terri::cars_uk

    As far as I'm aware there is no set time limit, but the longer the claim
    is left, the more the chance of it being unsuccessfull. These things
    take years to sort out anyway so a time limit may well not be practical.
    
    As for your second question, the original insurance company is still
    liable regardless of whether he has moved on. Your son was insured
    at that time and they will be liable (assuming they don't small print
    their way out of it) for any compensation paid to the other party. It
    may be worth getting legal advice anyway though. If this claim against
    your son is successful his premiums may well rise considerably
    especially as I suspect he is still quite young.
    
    This type of incident makes it clear that it is quite foolish to drive
    without insurance.
    
    
    Jerome. 

    As you say it seems logical that the claim should be made against the 
    company you were insured with at the time.
    
    This is interesting as when I change insurance companies I tend to 
    throw old policies that are no longer valid. This could make things
    very awkward if something like this came in out of the blue.
    
    Roy

>    	1. Is there a time limit following the accident, after which 
>           claims are no longer acceptable ?

Yes. There is a time within which a person must notify you that they intend to
claim. If this is the first intimation you have had that a claim is to be made,
then I suspect they've exceeded the time. However, I expect that you (your son)
were told of their intention to claim at the time. This effectively gives them
all the time in the world to claim.

Also, you must have told your insurers that there was an outstanding claim.
Since it is an injury claim, they cannot refuse to deal with it, but they could
reclaim their costs from you.

Also, you should have told your subsequent insurers that there was an
outstanding claim, which would have had an effect on further insurance premiums.

It is the insurance policy that was current at the time of the incident which is
relevant.

    ...presumably, if this has reached the summons stage, a great deal of
    paperwork has changed hands before now. If this has 'just come out of
    the blue', why has the 3rd party started with a summons ? Its my guess
    that 'an insurer' somewhere must be giving the 3rd party the
    run-around, and I assume he's pulling out the remainder of his hair.
    I think this is a case for professional help...
    
    	Tony.
    
    ( Incidentally whose name is on the summons, i.e. who's trying to sue
    ?)
    

    
    Re: .-1
    
    	The summons has the other drivers name as the person who is sueing
    my son.
    One other point is that the summons shows my sons name but an
    incorrect address, the address shown is our previous address, would
    this make any difference?.
    
    Regards
    
    Dave

It would explain why this is the first you've heard. Were you getting your mail
forwarded ? Not that it makes any difference to the claim, all he has to do is
mail your last known address and take reasonable care to ensure it all reached
you.

What actually happened in the accident ?

    I can't believe you haven't seen a lawyer yet.
    
    Laurie.

    
    	Re .6
    
    	As far as I know, the roads were wet and the car in front of my son
    stopped on a roundabout, my son braked and slid into the back of the
    car which had stopped pushing it across the road. The whiplash injury
    was said to have been caused when the car hit the kerb on the other
    side of the road. I believe that the speeds were quite slow (i.e. 15
    m.p.h.) but the wet road obviously reduced friction.
    One interesting point that has emerged is that this other driver was an
    MOD policeman (Oh my God I hear you cry!), but he has stated in the
    summons that the whiplash was made worse because he was wearing his
    helmet at the time. We have now discovered that MOD police are
    instructed that they are not to wear their helmets in the car because
    of the possibility of just such an injury as the one he sustained.
    
    Re .7
    
    	Can you explain your statement, I fully understand the need to take
    legal advice but my son was advised by the Insurance Company to take no
    action until they had clarified the situation. 
    
    Anyway, I would not expect my son to start to spend vast amounts of 
    money on lawyers fees unless the insurance company stated an intention
    to pass the cost onto him, the possibility of which was indicated in an
    earlier reply, it is in the insurers interests to fight the case in
    court and they will appoint a lawyer if appropriate. This has certainly
    been my experience when I had an accident in a Digital Lease vehicle.
    
    
    Regards
    
    Dave
    

I would forget any idea of fighting it at all, if I was you. The accident will
be deemed to be totally your son's fault. Whether or not the tp should have been
wearing his helmet, is irrelevant. It could potentially reduce the size of any
damages he receives, but the mere fact that he is receiving damages will affect
your son's insurance, the amount he receives will not. (Actually, if there was a
huge difference, it would have an effect, but there won't be (10%?))

>    	Can you explain your statement, I fully understand the need to take
>    legal advice but my son was advised by the Insurance Company to take no
>    action until they had clarified the situation. 

If it's a serious claim, it is often a good idea to invest a tenner in speaking
to a lawyer. You are only looking for advice, your insurers will deal with it,
but it can give you a level of confidence and possibly stop you making a
expensive mistake.
    
>    Anyway, I would not expect my son to start to spend vast amounts of 
>    money on lawyers fees unless the insurance company stated an intention
>    to pass the cost onto him, the possibility of which was indicated in an
>    earlier reply, it is in the insurers interests to fight the case in
>    court and they will appoint a lawyer if appropriate.

If you mean my reply, then I wasn't clear. An insurer can reclaim it's losses
from your son only if he has offended the t's & c's of his policy. If he behaved
appropriately - notified them asap, claim form within reasonable time, reported
it to the police, didn't admit liability at the scene etc etc - then he has
nothing to fear. This is slightly different in the case of a criminal
prosecution, where the insurer may decide to defend him, but would require a
contribution to their costs.

Assuming all is above board, then I would advise you to pass all to your son's
insurers and let them get on with it.

If there is something else, feel free to ask. If your son has not told his
existing insurers of this claim, then he is in breach of his current t's and c's
in that he has not disclosed a fact material to the risk. And in fact probably
said the opposite on the proposal form. That's up to him, if this is the case,
it is probably saving him money at the moment; however, he'd regret it if he had
a serious accident. Not that I am implying that he hasn't disclosed it.

    
    If you've got AA cover then call the legal advice section, up in Brumm
    I think, and they will doubtless provide the type of advice sought. As
    an AA member this is part and parcel of their deliverables.
    
    Ian
    
    PS. I think they may even talk to you if you're not a member.

    .9 fully covered my comment re: legal advice. If I thought I was about
    to be sued for 5K, and I was unsure as to whether or not I was covered
    by insurance, I'd be down the brief's office PDQ.
    
    Laurie.

    
    	Last weekend I hit someone up the back.We exchanged details and as
    i'm a young pup i've agreed to shoulder the cost myself.The owner of
    the car I hit will send me a quote for the damage,which i'll pay.My
    question is am I going to be assured that the quote is a resonable one
    (i.e. that he hasn't stuck a few quid on)if it goes through my
    insurance company.What I mean is will he have to go to a certain garage
    to get the estimate? Also,as I pushed his boot in,will they just
    replace the boot or will they try to knock it out?
    		
    	Andy....
    
    	How much are Escort Hatchbacks anyway.
    

    
    If you've not looked into the cost of repairing cars you might be in
    for a very unpleasant suprise.
    
    Without seeing the car it's impossible to be accurate about the cost of
    repairs, but as a guide, I had my Renault broken into 2 years ago and
    the damage extended to a broken lock and a small chip to the paintwork
    on the door and an equally small dent. Even explaining that this was a
    private job and I was happy with a best repair job (rather than total
    replacement) the best quote was �100 + PARTS!!!! 
    
    From your brief comments you're talking about multiple hundreds of
    pounds for the work. I thought from your original comments that you were 
    going to pay from your own pocket, but you then ask if it will be
    dearer because it'll go through your insurers. What's the point of 
    involving your insurers?
    
    Finally, if you'd hit me up the back, I'd go to the body shop that I
    had most faith in or who were most convenient to me. What on earth
    makes you think the third party is going to go out of his way to get
    the cheapest quote for your convenience?
    
    Mark

    re .12
     
    Even if you pay the costs yourself make sure you tell your insurers
    about it. This will mean filling in a claim and mark it for
    "information only". You will not loose your NCB. Insurers want to know
    about every incident you have. If you don't tell them it may have
    serious consequences later.
    
    Roy (talking from personal experience. If you want to know more, mail
    me)

    
    	Watch out!
    
    	Rear ends can be horribly expensive. I bumped my friends XR3 and
    	payed out of my own pocket. They knocked the boot out and the total
    	was just over 400 squids!
    
    	I was hit by a Shogun a little while ago and rear end repairs to
    	mine cost......2,400!
    
    	Tony B.

    
    RE-1
    
    	Tony,what do you drive,a roller?
    
    
    	I've just phoned my local Ford dealer and they said that the cost
    of a new hatchback unit for an Escort is 190.75 + VAT. This doesn't
    include fitting,could anyone take a guess at the cost with spraying and
    fitting?
    
    		I say about 550 pounds.Any advances??
    		
    	Andy.

    
    Did you damage JUST the hatch? How?
    
    Chances are the rear sill, lights, number plate, even the floorpan
    could be damaged.
    
    Mark

    
    	Iwas going very slowly and it just pushed the bottom of the hatch
    in,I didn't even crack the number plate.The front of my Astra was
    unscathed except for a smashed headlight (caused by my headlight spray
    unit hitting it).I missed his lights.
    
    	A minor miracle.
    
    	Andy

    
    	i only drive an XR3 but every panel on the back was dented.
    
    	New hatch, boot, boot floor, one set of light fittings,no. plate,
    	spoiler, bumper, one rear quarter, stickers + bumper insert.
    
    	Absolutely no damage to the Shogun though. Not even a broken light.
    
    	Tony

	Somebody went into the back of my Montego in a car park.

	I believe it was someone reversing, so not at speed!

	It didn't look to bad, the only damange was the bumper had a slight
	crack so had to be replaced.

	�400 + VAT     two years ago

	Heather
	(and an extra 140 when the keys were stolen, and they had to replace 
	the locks)

    
    Some swine drove into the back of me at the weekend.Not much damage (It
    was really just a nudge),when the guy got out of his car he came over
    to me and looked at the damage on my car and said "It'll cost a few
    pence to fix that,it's just a clip you need for the bumper,i'm in the
    trade you know"
    	After an estimate today at Gowerings bodyshop,I found the damage to
    come to the total of 250 quid.
    
    Good job I got his details (Yet he couldn't remember his insurance
    company name is this something to worry about?)
    
    
    Moral:Don't beleive the lying B@�$!R%S.
    
    Andy

>    Good job I got his details (Yet he couldn't remember his insurance
>    company name is this something to worry about?)
 

	I Don't know my insurance company name.......why should I, I never
	deal with them, even through my last accident including personal
	injury.

	However, I do know my brokers name - which I gave

	Heather

If you got a shunt from behind, sue the b%$^&*d for personal injury...

Go to your local Hospital A&E and say you have been in a shunt and you have a
pain in your neck. They will give you a collar to wear for a few days. They
don't care as its no skin off their nose.

Then SUE !!! 

I got #600 for a shunt a year or so ago.

>Go to your local Hospital A&E and say you have been in a shunt and you have a
>pain in your neck. They will give you a collar to wear for a few days. They
>don't care as its no skin off their nose.
    
    If this isn't true, then it's called fraud so the local hospital should
    be more careful as they then become accessories to the crime. Anyone
    who tries this should be shot (preferably at birth).

    RE: .23
    
    Are you of American descent or do have a financial interest in
    insurance companies having to pay out money ? :-)
    
    tp

    Nowadays, it's almost de rigueur to put in a personal injuries claim -
    genuine or not. And people - like myself - who were actually injured,
    hesitate to claim, to avoid being called "fraudsters", and other "f"
    words.
    
    However, I know of one person who sued purely to make it as difficult
    as possible for the offending party to ever get back on the road again.
    
    Mike 

>Go to your local Hospital A&E and say you have been in a shunt and you have a
>pain in your neck. They will give you a collar to wear for a few days. They
>don't care as its no skin off their nose.


	A collar is not always the right thing.

	The doctor advised against it, because he said the neck needed rest,
	and a collar support would only encourage me to do too much.

	Two weeks later, still with pain, I was at the physio. She said I was
	lucky I hadn't worn a collar, as, now the swelling was down, they
	found I had problems with the bone of the first and second
	virtibrae, where they had knocked together. I had to keep my chin
	in, not out as a collar would have done.

	The other insurers have so far coughed up for the physio, and special
	support pillow, and drugs. (as well as car repair and 5-day car hire
	whilst it was in for repair)

	I am being assessed in about 3 weeks - the insurers want to give me a 
	lump sum, and be done with it.
	As I still have problems, I think I'd rather have the treatment paid 
	for.....especially if all they want to do is give me 600 quid.

	Heather

In actual fact I did have slight whiplash and so the claim wasn't fraudulent.

However, it will make the boy racer who hit me think again about speeding as his
insurance costs have hopefully gone sky high.

As to having something to gain in making insurance companies pay - well, I pay
out a fortune in insurance so why shouldn't I get some of it back if I can.

The reply about accessories (after the fact, it should be) should be taken with
a pince of salt as it is nearly impossible to prove you haven't hurt your neck,
even slightly, and the hospital could probably be sued (there's that word again)
for negligence if they didn't take you seriously and try and help. What would
happen if you had had some serious damage done ?

    It's always a good idea to go to the hospital as a precautionary
    measure: a neck injury usually takes a while (several hours) to
    manifest itself, once the numbness and 'heavy-head' feeling pass.
    
    re: Suing
    
    Well, you're either honest or you're not - it's that simple.
    
    Mike
    

>>  Well, you're either honest or you're not - it's that simple.

I'm not sure it's just a question of honesty. It's whether you want to teach the
s*#$s a lesson and hence make the roads a little safer for other folk...

    I suspect the effect on the boy-racer is that he will now be driving
    without insurance.
    
    Woe betide the next person he hits.
    
    Andrew

and each insurance claim causes the premiums to increase for everybody.

Even with 10% more discount my renewal premium was more than the previous one. 

Simon

>In actual fact I did have slight whiplash and so the claim wasn't fraudulent.
    
    I was trying to suggest your claim was frauulent.
    
>The reply about accessories (after the fact, it should be) should be taken with
>a pince of salt as it is nearly impossible to prove you haven't hurt your neck,
>even slightly, and the hospital could probably be sued (there's that word again)
>for negligence if they didn't take you seriously and try and help. What would
>happen if you had had some serious damage done ?
    
    I couldn't car less whether it was after the fact, before the fact or
    during the fact. The fact is that people are wasting hard pressed
    resources just because they fancy getting a few quid on the side if
    they go to hospital when there's is nothing wrong with them. OK I agree
    it's a good idea to go for a check-up if you're in a RTA. I was forced
    to by the police after an accident even though I didn't want to. What I
    have problems with is people going along and making false claims. I
    agree with the reply which stated it's basically down to one's honesty.
    And yes they will take you seriously if you go along even with a false
    claim because it is difficult to prove you haven't done any minor
    damage. But they shouldn't be put in that position in the first place.
    Having treatment paid for is fair enough but claiming a few hundred
    just because you've bruised yourself in a couple of places is well...
    complete nonsense.
    
    

    
    Last year I hit someone up the back,the guy then claimed for whiplash.
    In my opinion the accident was only a nudge and I couldn't believe that
    he claimed personal injury.I was going to try to settle without
    insurance claims,but his solicitor informed me that he was chasing
    personal injury.The thing is tha accident occured in Oakhampton
    (Devon or somerset) and the individual lives in Liverpool.
    
    Perhaps not whiplash just fatigue,aches and pains that come with
    driving lond distances.
    
    	I'm still fuming now!
    Andy and-that's-exactly-one-year-ago.

	Oakhampton is in Devon, in fact, it's much closer to Cornwall than
	Somerset...........if you don't even know where you are, how do you 
	think you could tell if he had whiplash?

	I would NEVER settle outside insurance, even if it was 50 quid.
	I pay fully comp and legal assist so they sort it out.

	To get compensation for whiplash, you have to have a quite hefty 
	medical.......and I don't want the compensation, I'd rather have
	the treatment - which has cost over 250 quid so far!


	Heather

    
> 	Oakhampton is in Devon, in fact, it's much closer to Cornwall than
> 	Somerset...........if you don't even know where you are, how do you 
> 	think you could tell if he had whiplash?
    
    I assume you're talking about Okehampton, Heather. Surely someone from
    Devon should know how to spell it ? But I think you make an entirely
    spurious point. What effect should one's memory of geography have to do
    with one's memory of a specific incident ?
    
    Trevor

    
>    I assume you're talking about Okehampton, Heather. Surely someone from
>    Devon should know how to spell it ?

	I am dyslexic, and have always found spelling to be my weak point,
	however, being from Devon, or anywhere else, does not have any impact
	on my spelling.

>   But I think you make an entirely
>    spurious point. What effect should one's memory of geography have to do
>    with one's memory of a specific incident ?
    
    Trevor,

	Well, the note said that being from Liverpool, and such a long way away
	from home could have been the cause of the whiplash claim.

	I thought it strange that somone could say this when they were quite a
	long way from where they thought they were themselves.

	
	Heather

    
    RE-1
    
    	Heather,
         	I was refering to the fact that when I got home from that
    particular trip I had a sore neck,and various other aches and pains,and
    so would consider it a possibility that the other person involved may
    have similar aches and pains which he may have misconstude as being 
    whiplash.
    
    Long trip + stress = aches and pains.
    
    
    Andy.
    		

>         	I was refering to the fact that when I got home from that
>    particular trip I had a sore neck,and various other aches and pains,and
>    so would consider it a possibility that the other person involved may
>    have similar aches and pains which he may have misconstude as being 
>    whiplash.
 
	In my case, the medical assesment is 6 months after the injury, to
	assess any continuing damage.......plus doctors notes, and physio
	info.

	If he wasn't as bad, his assessment could have been earlier, but you
	can bet your bottom dollar, your insurance hasn't paid 1700 quid out
	for whiplash injuries just on his say-so - they assess injuries 
	with qualified doctors that your insurers appoint.

	Heather

    .28
    
    >However, it will make the boy racer who hit me think again about
    >speeding .......
    
    Simon, I been a passanger in your car, you mean he was a bigger boy
    racer than you?    8-)
    
    
    ..Craig