Conference 7.286::home_work

    Renewal is Rayovac, not Panasonic.  I have a set of Renewal batteries
    and the charger, but have yet to use the charger.  I have not seen
    any unbiased reviews of this technology, but I'd have to assume that
    unless the batteries were designed with vents that it would be unsafe
    to try recharging them.
    
    					Steve

My husband recharges his Radio Shack rechargeables in my Renewal station all
the time.  I keep an eye on it, but it seems to work.

Elaine

re .2:

But those RS rechargeables are NiCad, right?

re: .3

Yes,  I've only used Ni-Cad rechargeables in my Renewal station.

Elaine

    re: all
    
    I appreciate the responses.  One question though re nicad responses:
    
    Premise:
    My understanding is that the technology used in enabling Alkaline to be
    rechaged also works for ni-cad.  This would explain .4
    
    Question:
    1. to those that have used Ni-cad batteries in renewal stations:  have
    you also used Alkaline batteries
    
    2. have mixed Ni-cad charing and Alkaline charging? (probably not a
    smart thing to do but I'm curious)
    
    Thanks for all the replies.
    
    Phil

    For the record, I purchase a Renewal Power Station.  I does not accept
    ordinary alkaline batteries.  The slots are designed to only accept a
    battery with an extended tip.
    
    Guess I'll have to mail order for the BuddyL.  Thanks anyway.
    
    Phil

    The December Consumer Reports has a sidebar on rechargeable alkalines.
    They say that the Renewals don't last as long initially and have
    progressively shorter lives through recharging.  However, they have
    an advantage over nicads in that they don't gradually lose their
    charge.
    
    					Steve

    ... the same issue also reviews the BuddyL. They weren't impressed.

>                                                     However, they have
>    an advantage over nicads in that they don't gradually lose their
>    charge.

I don't understand this sentence.  I find that NiCads lose their charge
very suddenly.  From the time my walkman starts slowing down till the time
it stops altogether is a minute or so, much quicker than ordinary alkalines.
If you're saying that NiCads eventually don't hold as long a charge, it seems
that Renewals also have this problem.

    re .9
    
    The issue was whether they lose their charge when not in use. After
    being charged, a NiCad will drain on its own over a fairly short
    time (measured in days) if it's removed from the charger and not
    used. The alkalines don't do this (nearly as fast).

Exactly.  The alkalines basically don't lose their charge at all over the
cell's useful life.  Also, the alkalines come "pre-charged".   I put a set
of the Renewals in a water timer this past spring - they're faded now, but
it still works.  If I had used NiCads, I would have had to recharge them
a dozen times or more over the summer.


					Steve

    > ... the same issue also reviews the BuddyL. They weren't impressed.
    >
    
    Unfortunate.  I haven't read the article but I expected a better review
    based on the BuddyL's ability to charge both NiCad and Alkaline
    batteries from any manufacturer.
    
    Oh well, you try to do the right thing for the environment and still
    can't find cost-effective solutions...
    
    Phil                               

    
    	I have a 10 year old sone with several radio control cars and other
    battery operated toys so we bought a NiCad recharger and a slew of
    batterys 5 years or more.   They do lose their charge after just about
    a month of doing nothing.
    	Another problem of NiCads not yet mentioned is that the full charge
    voltage is about  .2 volts less than the alkaline batterys.
     about 1.5 volts vs 1.7 volts.   Because of this NICads are not
    recommended for use in childrens hand held games as NINTENDO's GAME BOY
    and SEGA's GAME GEAR.  4 NiCADs = 6 volts  vs  4 ALKALINE = 6.8 volts.
    
    	Last year either Popular Science or Popular Mechanics in the
    Sept./Oct time frame had a very interesting article on both the Buddy L
    and the Renewal chargeers.   Based on that article, I bought the
    Renewal charger and  a bunch of Renewal batteries and I do prefer these
    over the Nicads.  Have yet do through out a RENEWAL battery.
    
    	One last comment;  Rayovac is touting the RENEWALS because they are
    more envirormental friendly.  [Almost no mercury.] 

All of the current crop of alkaline cells are essentially mercury-free.
But Renewals have the advantage that you throw out fewer of them.

					Steve

>    	Another problem of NiCads not yet mentioned is that the full charge
>    voltage is about  .2 volts less than the alkaline batterys.

close....

>     about 1.5 volts vs 1.7 volts.   

Actually NiCads are 1.2 volts, carbon-zinc (standard dry cell) is 1.5,
alkaline are (as I recall, but I'm less sure of this) just below carbon-zinc
at 1.45.  This is still nominally 1.5.
Cordless tools come with power cells in multiples of 1.2 because they
all use NiCads - 4.8, 7.2, 9.6, 12, 13.2, 14.4, etc.

>    Because of this NICads are not
>    recommended for use in childrens hand held games as NINTENDO's GAME BOY
>    and SEGA's GAME GEAR.  4 NiCADs = 6 volts  vs  4 ALKALINE = 6.8 volts.

Yeah, we tried NiCads when we bought my daughter a Game Gear a few years ago.
We got about 20 minutes of playing time on a freshly charged set.
At 4 cells at .3 volts each, you start over a full volt below nominal.
(That's NiCads 4.8, alkaline 6.0.)

- tom]

I skimmed the CR article, and I think it said that while NiCads' voltage
starts out lower, alkalines go down in voltage faster.  So fresh alkalines
will have higher voltage, but non-fresh alkalines will have lower voltage
than non-fresh NiCads.

It seems that NiCads are well-suited to Walkmans, but poorly suited to
toys and flashlights.

re .16:

>It seems that NiCads are well-suited to Walkmans, but poorly suited to
>toys and flashlights.

They work great in a flashlight designed for their voltage.  I have a
Maglite (essentially a cop flashlight) that uses NiCads and it's great.
The only problem is when the batteries go dead they go dead pretty fast,
there's not much time between noticeably dimmer and nearly dead compared
to normal alkaline or zinc-carbon cells.

-Mike

    
    .17
    
    NiCads are also much lighter, which effects the other potential
    use of a Maglite.  ;-)
       

Another thing is that most C and D-size NiCad cells are just AA cells in
a bigger package.  That means they don't have the current capacity one expects
of the larger cells.  An exception is Radio Shack's line of "High Capacity"
NiCad cells.

					Steve

re .18:

The thing still weighs over two pounds, it'd still make a halfway
decent weapon...

-Mike

I suppose it depends on how often you use a flashlight.  I seldom use one,
so NiCads would be the wrong choice for me.

    one time while talking to a profesional photographer, he mentioned that
    he prefered the nicad rechargale batteries because they "come back" so
    quick.  I have noticed this also, a photo flash is ready for the next
    picture very quickly.  However, the flash will basicly stop charging 
    with no warning (slow charge).
    
    I use the nicads in my daughters fisher price flashlight (the only
    flashlight I can ever find), and have had to recharge the batteries
    only every few months.
    
    paul

For photo flash use, the best are lithium cells.  I agree with the
professional photographer that NiCds recycle faster in a flash.  But
lithiums are even better and last much longer.  Don't use lithium cells
as a general replacement for alkaline or NiCds, though.

				Steve

    
    I used NiCads in a brand new photo flash, and it broke after a very
    short time. The directions (I know...) said not to use NiCads. I
    sheepishly brought the unit back to the store, which gracefully
    exchanged it, and the replacement flash has been working for some
    years on alkalines.
    
    GameBoy-type games typically warn against using NiCads.
    
    On the other hand the NiCads were great for the flashlights and
    motorized toys my kids loved to play with when they were little.
    

>    GameBoy-type games typically warn against using NiCads.

Any idea why?

    
    -1
    
    I used to think it was because they were in cahoots with the energizer
    bunny, but a couple of electronic toys belonging to my little'un have
    died recently.  I used NiCads against the mfctrs warnings.  Must be
    something to do with the lower 1.2v voltage, mentioned previously.