Conference 7.286::home_work

    Bradlees (at least the nashua stores do) has a section of how to
    type books.  I was flipping through one a week ago or so.  

    Oh well....
    
    I thought kids were supposed to build a treehouse to get away from
    their parents, using old lumber they found in the basement and 
    garage and in vacant lots.  But...it probably is prudent to lend
    an unobtrusive hand with the initial structural framing.  A friend
    and I built an elegant 3-story treehouse, but as I recall his old
    man contributed a couple of 2x6's, some 20-penny nails, and the
    arm power to drive them into the tree to give us a solid base to
    work from.
    Is it a good idea to drive nails into a tree?  Probably not.  But
    the tree will survive.
    Do you need pressure-treated lumber?  No.

    Avoid copper or brass nails they will kill the tree regular nails
    wont be a problem though. My uncle built a tree house on salvaged
    telephone poles for his kids now the grand children play in it.
    A tree house built in a tree is subjected to more stresses from
    wind movement than one built on posts and wont last as long.
    BTW- taking down a tree house after its useful days are over can
    be pretty tricky when nailed bolts would make it alot easier.
    
    -j who built many tree houses
    

    Another consideration that may not be covered in the construction books
    is the area around the tree. Make sure it is free of pointy rocks and
    sticks. This can help avoid a major tragedy WHEN (not IF) they
    fall/jump out. Bruises are far easier to treat than puncture wounds.

    When I built mine it was about 35 feet off the ground, noone ever
    fell out of it.  My father couldn't climb the tree so he couldn't
    help with it, I did this on purpose.  I did use his tools though, 
    especially the pulley....

    So I'd say let your kids build it themselves and if your real worried
    just check on it as it progresses to make sure it wont colapse on them.

    George

re: .5  Ditto... Most of the fun comes from having built it yourself.

Bob

I guess the obvious question is the age of the children involved.

I built a tree house for my kids when they were 5 and 6 so I only put it around
8 feet off the ground.  I put up railings, etc. to make it safer, but now that
they're a couple of years older they simply use the railings as something to
climb on.

As far as construction, I took some 2X8's I got when I ripped out our deck and
nailed a couple across some major limbs.  I can't remember if I used 16d or 20d
nails, but when I was done I essentially had 2 very strong floor joists about
6 or 7 feet apart.  Across these I put the floor boards that also came out of
the deck.  The result was a tree house that was already painted!  And it only
took a day.

As for letting the kids do it themselves, I'd second the motion provided they're
older.  How old is old?  I guess it depends on the kids...

-mark

    Well, my kids are 15, 13 and 7.  The 13 & 7 year olds (both girls)
    are the most interested in this project.  I have to admit that I
    am also a kid when it comes to this project.  I never got a chance
    to build a tree house when I was a kid and now I want to get in
    on the action also.  But I thank you all for putting me on the right
    track.  You are right that a tree house would probably be best (and
    most enjoyed) if the kids themselves are the engineers and carpenters
    (under my watchful eye, of course).
    
    I think I'll begin by asking my girls to draw pictures of what they
    want the tree house to look like and go from there.  I think they
    are picturing something that looks like a real house, only in a
    tree.

    Just another FWIW, my younger brother who is 10 yrs younger, built
    a tree house behind the house that only had one wall.  Yep, it faced
    the house.  I think he was about 9 at the time.  It was only 5-6 feet
    off the ground.  It looked kinda funny if viewed from any direction other
    than from the house.  But I guess it was just enough to get away from 
    the ever watchful 'rents...

    George

    
    
    If you want to get real fancy find a Bob Leathers playground and
    let your kids look through it. You can get alot of structural
    ideas from it also. I was involved in building one in Pepperell
    and there is one in Lunenburg. They are all over the place and
    very well constructed.
    
    ace
    

    My dad and I built ours.  The neighborhood was being built and most
    of the materials came from new construction.  My dad got the ladder
    out and we put a pair of 2x10s on either side of 1 tree.  We built
    a box out of 2x6s 8ft square.  With the perimeter defined, we used
    2x4s on 16 centers to create joists.  We used 2x4s from the corner
    of the frame at angles down to the tree.  This way we had a 8ft
    square with a tree in the middle with 4 supports out to the corners
    and 4 shorter supports to help support the other direction.  We
    used scrap plywood for a floor and built a trap door.  We then built
    a wall for each side with 3 2x4s, 2 for uprights and the other for
    a top plate.  We ran "ceiling/roof" joists back at an angle to the
    tree.  Covered the roof with scrap plywood, stolen tarpaper, and
    stolen shingles.  Dad insisted we have a rail at waist height. 
    We could have solid walls on the 2 sides away from the house but
    the 2 sides facing the house had to have openings.

    Dad bought some of the nails and made sure the basic support system
    and floor were adequate.  I remember spending many long hours staining
    the tree house so it would hide in the woods.  
    
    I think that it should be a joint effort.  The kids should have
    a hand in the design and construction but the parents should keep
    an eye out for structural integrity for basic support and floor.   

    One other consideration.....
    
    One town we lived in made us tear ours down.  It didn't meet code!
    When we asked was the code was we were told "There is no code
    specifically for treehouses, therefore you have to meet the regular
    building code which includes a foundation."  Our reply was you can't
    put a foundation on a treehouse.  Their reply was "Rright, you can't 
    build one."
    
    Check to make sure the governing body of your town is not a bunch
    of "old party poopers".

    
    RE: .12
    
    What's they're definition of "foundation".  American Heritage
    Dictionary defines it as "the basis on which something stands;
    underlying support."  Sounds like the tree to me!!!  I shudda been
    a lawyer... ;-)
    

Isn't the key requirement for a foundation that it go below the frost line?
Sounds like a tree would meet that quite well.

-mark

Re: .14

	Ahhh....but did you have it inspected before it was covered up?
Does this mean that you need to get a building premit issued before you 
plant? For Mass residents...the Duke may have overlookd a goldmine -- all
these years, these treehouse owners have been failing to pay their property
taxes!
						>>>==>PStJTT

	Re: .15

	Shhhhhhhh.......  Don't say such things too loudly when the Duke is
looking for more $$$s....

	Anyway, I bet all of the treehouses are illegal unless they were built
by an official People's Republic state licensed treehouse builder.

								-c

re: .12
>   One town we lived in made us tear ours down.  It didn't meet code!
>   When we asked was the code was we were told "There is no code
>   specifically for treehouses, therefore you have to meet the regular
>   building code which includes a foundation."

My first question would be what "code" the nerd is referring to?  I have a copy
of the BOCA book (Birch, Oak, Cherry, Ash) and the question of foundations, as
previously cited, is clearly addressed in Section 19, paragraph 3a:
	No Tree shall be used for a Primitive Structure unless and until
	its Support System extends below the surface to a point at least:
	1. one-third of its height above ground  and  2. eight feet (2.44 m).
Your building inspector may have the 1794 edition.  I have the latest edition,
which was revised and updated in 1839.

re: .15
>Does this mean that you need to get a building premit issued before you plant?

This should be of little concern.  For one thing, if you plant now, chances are
you won't be able to use it, under the BOCA regulation quoted above, for quite
a while.  For another, most governing bodies have a grandfather provision which
exempts most trees, since the inspector's grandfather likely planted them.

re: .16
>	Anyway, I bet all of the treehouses are illegal unless they were built
>by an official People's Republic state licensed treehouse builder.

This is, of course, the normal, paranoid reaction to learning about treehouse
regulations, at least in Massachusetts.  You all have my condolences.  Here in
New Hampshire, we don't have to worry any more, at least after last year's
referendum.  Our elected representatives in Concord debated long and loud about
amending the ages-old and never-adhered-to regulations, to allow non-licensed
builders, with a maximum age limit of 13, to build their own treehouses without
governmental interference.  The final vote was 673 to 218.  The state-wide
referendum, of 27 for, 5 against, decided it.

    
    Not to get too serious about this after all this frivolity ...
    
    Each town decides if it will allow structures under a certain size to
    be built without a permit and not meeting building codes. Usually this
    is done to allow for things like small sheds to be built. In my town
    they don't allow this, but the building inspector doesn't make you
    conform to a full house spec for sheds, he merely makes sure that what
    you built is solid and meets zoning reqmnts. 
    
    I had a treehouse when I was a kid (built in the woods of course) and I
    would want to build one for my kids (if I ever buy any). Then again, if
    my neighbors put up something unsightly out in the front yard, I'm sure
    I'd want to have the legal right to ask that it be torn down...